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View Full Version : Question for the body/paint guys



KevinD
02-15-2011, 11:32 PM
Hey, gotta quick question. My 03 dodge Ram Quad Cab was totally repainted about 3-4 years ago (Dodge factory Patriot Blue) and the shop that did it has gone out of business.
Now the clear coat is peeling badly, and some of the base coat has bubbles(?) under the paint. Thinking of having it repainted, but I think I have to take the fubared stuff down to the orig paint/metal first. Is this my only option? I ask because that's a shit load of sanding.

Pony
02-15-2011, 11:41 PM
Just peeling around the edges? (moldings/handles etc)

Basically yes. If it's only peeling around the masked edges then you can probably just sand down the areas that are peeling. If it's failing in the middle of the panels that's a sign of poor prep work or not enough clearcoat and it will need to be taken down to the original finish or wherever the failure occured. (clear has U/V protection in it, not thick enough the sun will break it down).

Same with the bubbles. if they are bigger than pinpricks it's probably something underneath. (filler/rust) and needs to be removed to the fail point.

Do you plan on doing some/all of the work yourself? Skill level?

KevinD
02-15-2011, 11:45 PM
Due to $$ I am probably gonna have to do the sanding myself. I've done some before (years ago) and had good luck, but, def NOT a bodyman. Gonna check with the guy I had repaint my CSRT4 and see what type of primer or other stuff I will need to use. I was hoping there's be an easy 'Magic" fix, but I knew there really wasn't hahaha

Pony
02-15-2011, 11:54 PM
The best thing you can do to save money is disassemble it. It may not have been done last time but it's the right way to do it to avoid problems. Take off all handles, moldings and anything that sits directly on the paint. As far as the repair goes a lot of it is making sure you're not using too aggressive or two fine a grit sandpaper for the particular task at hand.
Gonna be using air tools or hand sanding? Pics would help too.

KevinD
02-16-2011, 12:03 AM
Oh, It def wasn't done the last time.. I was out of the country when my wife had the hail damage repaired and repainted. The knucklehead even shot clear over the chrome plastic emblems (shakes head). I'll try and get some pic tomorrow. Not sure when I'm gonna start on it, as right now, it's my daily driver. Plus I need to get a bunch of stuff cleared out of my shop (from moving my father-in-law in with us) I had planned to take off all the trip and handles I can before I start sanding. I've got a 1100 sq ft shop I can't even get into right now.

KevinD
02-16-2011, 12:05 AM
As for paper, I'm thinking of starting with about 100 grit to remove all the badness, then going lighter and fogging a coat of grey primer to get my panels smooth again.

Cactus
02-16-2011, 12:46 AM
Kevin, was this done thru insurance work or just straight out of pocket? If was insurance work, do you choose the shop or was it recommended by your carrier? know you said the shop is going out of business, but if it was insurance work and they recommended the shop, they should be able to help you? If it was insurence work and you chose the shop, they may be help you as well?

If not you may be SOL.

Pony
02-16-2011, 11:45 AM
That's a good point. If it was hail damage covered by the insurance and you're still with the same company, they may warranty it.

KevinD
02-16-2011, 12:35 PM
Yeah, it (the orig damage) was hail, covered by my ins. shop of my (wife's) choosing. My ins say that sue to the age of the repair, and the truck, and since the company that did the repair is out of business, there's nothing they (ins) can do. Once the sun get up more, I'll take some pics.

KevinD
02-16-2011, 01:45 PM
Here's some pics. It's pretty overcast today, so these are the best I could get:

Top of doors (all 4 look like this)
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq223/kmdracer/DSC03946.jpg

Cab roof:
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq223/kmdracer/DSC03945.jpg

Hood (both sides are the same)
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq223/kmdracer/DSC03943.jpg

Two pics trying to so the general overall "bubbling of paint. This is pretty much everywhere.
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq223/kmdracer/DSC03944.jpg
http://i450.photobucket.com/albums/qq223/kmdracer/DSC03947.jpg

redred
02-16-2011, 02:12 PM
thats shocking for 3 ish year old repairs,looks like a friday afternoon special

KevinD
02-16-2011, 02:27 PM
Yep pretty shitty work. Unfortunately, my Camaro was repainted by the same shop, at the same time, and it looks about the same. Clearcoat is peeling, and bubbles all over the place.

redred
02-16-2011, 02:28 PM
bad paint batch?

KevinD
02-16-2011, 02:30 PM
Maybe on the clear if he used the same for both vehicles, but the Camaro is Black, the truck is Blue. So no excuses for the piss poor base coat except for the painter screwed up somewhere along the way.

Noilly Pratt
02-16-2011, 03:26 PM
The person who painted your truck should be shot, and if he survives, shot again!

I had this happen on a gold Dodge 600 I had eons ago. Poor prep work for sure. And it can get Really worse in just a couple of months. I left it for a year and it looked awful. Since it was a trunk lid only I ended up getting one from the Junkyard.

Pony
02-16-2011, 05:34 PM
Looks like U/V fail to me from either cheap clear without adequate protection or just not enough film build. Yea, you're gonna have to take it all off down to the factory finish or the primer in spots where they repaired.

I'd get a cheap compressor, a decent D/A sander (fine sanding pattern/finish DA) and a couple rolls of 150 and 320 grit paper.

First take a new razor blade and holding it almost flat see how much you can get off with that on the big flat areas. Be careful not to let the blade catch and dig into the surface.
Take the sander and 150 grit, keep it flat as possible and basically try and just take off 80% of the top layer of paint. (just the clearcoat) I usually try and do a 15x15 area then move on to the next area. Don't focus on the edge, try and take the whole section down evenly. .instead of just doing a little spot then a little spot It's easier to keep it flat doing a bigger section all at once.
Once the whole panel is done switch to the 320 grit and take off the remaining 20% and the basecoat. be as careful as possible not to get into any repaired areas, if you see primer and it looks stable, leave it alone.

Talk to your painter and see if he would prefer to prime and final sand it and how much extra that would be. We hate when people bring something in already primed and the customers saying "It's ready for paint" 9 times out of 10 it's not, and the paintjob looks like shit if we just shoot it. (of course it's the paints fault then, not the poor bodywork says the customer).

KevinD
02-16-2011, 05:59 PM
Thanks Pony. I totally understand what you mean about bringing in a car "ready to paint" I'm going to try and take the truck to my painter and have him give me a quote on them doing all the work first. I just know it's gonna be a couple k though. Not sure I want to spend that much on this truck. It's an 03 with 208k miles and it's my work truck. I may just leave it as is, and give it to my daughter when she starts driving. I'm sure that I am capable of doing the prep work. It's the downtime involved that's gonna most likely prevent me from doing it myself.
If the shop can do it for 1500 or so, I'll almost definitely let them do it, and then I will do the prep on the Camaro myself, though I'm going to have to read up on composite panels and how to prep them first.

Goofy
02-16-2011, 06:08 PM
Just noticed this thread, looks like PP has it covered :lol: I'm not surprised the company went out of business........ 3 year old repair looking like that :wha: We give a 3 year warranty on all of our paintwork......... we'd be out of business in seconds with stuff like that :lol:

KevinD
02-16-2011, 06:18 PM
Another option I'm debating is to start hitting the junkyards and find good orig paint metal (bed, doors, fenders) then all that has to be repainted is the roof. The bodyshop/painter I will be using Is a place I found in the town next to mine. They've been in business for 30 years, have a lifetime warranty on paint. I had my CSRT4 repainted there after the wreck, so far it still looks fabulous. (Funny thing is, two of the guys I was on the Fire Dept with for 15 years work there, and I knew it, had just forgotten about it when the hail damage happened.)

Pony
02-16-2011, 08:41 PM
Just noticed this thread, looks like PP has it covered :lol: I'm not surprised the company went out of business........ 3 year old repair looking like that :wha: We give a 3 year warranty on all of our paintwork......... we'd be out of business in seconds with stuff like that :lol:

Most of the shops here do a lifetime warranty for as long as you own the car. (rust not included).


Another option I'm debating is to start hitting the junkyards and find good orig paint metal (bed, doors, fenders) then all that has to be repainted is the roof. The bodyshop/painter I will be using Is a place I found in the town next to mine. They've been in business for 30 years, have a lifetime warranty on paint. I had my CSRT4 repainted there after the wreck, so far it still looks fabulous. (Funny thing is, two of the guys I was on the Fire Dept with for 15 years work there, and I knew it, had just forgotten about it when the hail damage happened.)

I think that would be a lot more expensive depending on the prices in your area. Here just a clean bed alone would be $1500+

KevinD
02-16-2011, 08:45 PM
That's possible. I haven't found any good prices yet (in the right color) Just exploring all my options.

Pony
02-16-2011, 08:51 PM
Not a bad thought but the likelyhood that you'll find all those parts with decent paint, no damage and in the right color for a reasonable price is slim. A number of years ago the bigger boneyards caught up with the industry and now network part availability and shipping nationwide. They know exactly how much that part costs new, how much aftermarket and price them slightly below. We get stuff shipped from all over the country.

Smaller boneyards get the scraps because the bigger ones can now afford to bid more. It's really driven the used part prices through the roof in the last decade.

KevinD
02-17-2011, 12:03 AM
Yeah, sigh, I've noticed that : junkyard prices going up. Trying to find decent interior parts for the Z28, and the Ram. Note to all...NEVER, EVEr under any circumstances use ArmourAll on you interior plastics. Over time, it (along with sunlight) causes major cracking and failure. I use Mother's now, designed for plastics (not vinyl like ArmourAll)

Pony
02-17-2011, 12:09 AM
Good tip!
Armorall will dry out the plastics. Also drys out the tires but most people replace those often enough.

KevinD
02-17-2011, 12:13 AM
Yeah, just wish I had known it 9 years ago. Hahahaha

Scuzzbopper
02-17-2011, 09:19 PM
You can save yourself alot of sanding by stripping that shitty paint off with a razor scraper. It takes a little practice to get the light touch needed to not go too deep but it's super easy. I use this technique quite often. Especially on early to mid 90's Fords. They used a terrible primer sealer for those years and the paint just lifts off like scraping your windshield. Use caution on the rounder parts, try to keep the blade in contact with the paint as much as you can. I know the Ram has very few level planes, I hate working on them because of that, but take your time. If the paint resists the blade leave it for sanding, if it flies off like snowflakes, you're on the right track. I stripped a '92 'Stang in 3 hours like that. Right down to that shitty black primer sealer. Then just wet sand, reseal, reprime and repaint. Easy cheesy brah.

Pony
02-17-2011, 09:47 PM
Yea Scuzzy, I love when the paint just comes right off like that, really does make life easy.

Goofy
02-22-2011, 07:43 PM
Most of the shops here do a lifetime warranty for as long as you own the car. (rust not included).


You dont have the same shit on the roads that we do :|

Pony
02-22-2011, 10:12 PM
You dont have the same shit on the roads that we do :|

:confused:

I live in Cleveland Ohio, right in the heart of the "rust belt". They mine salt from under Lake Erie and use it generously on the roads all winter. Rots the hell out of everything.

Muddy
04-09-2011, 12:26 PM
I've got a 98' Dodge Ram and the paint on the hood and roof started getting tiny bubbles and recently it all (75%) came off in huge sheets.. Im interested in getting it repaired but I think they will have to strip the thing down to bare metal..