Bank of America to charge $5 debit card fee

[Teh One Who Knocks]

By CANDICE CHOI - Associated Press


NEW YORK -- Bank of America plans to start charging customers a $5 monthly fee for using their debit card to make purchases. The fee will be rolled out starting early next year.

A number of banks have already either rolled out or are testing such fees. But Bank of America ( BAC - news - people )'s announcement carries added weight because it is the largest U.S. bank by deposits.

Anne Pace, a Bank of America Corp. spokeswoman, said Thursday that customers will only be charged the fee if they use their debit cards for purchases in any given month. Customers won't be charged if they only use their cards at an ATM.

The fee will apply to basic accounts and will be in addition to any existing monthly service fees. For example, one of the bank's basic accounts charges a $12 monthly fee unless customers meet certain conditions, such as maintaining a minimum average balance of $1,500.

A fee for using debit cards is still a novel concept for many consumers and was unheard of before this year. But there are signs it may soon become an industry norm.

SunTrust, a regional bank based in Atlanta, began charging a $5 debit card fee on its basic checking accounts this summer. Regions Financial ( RF - news - people ), which is based in Birmingham, Ala., plans to start charging a $4 fee next month.

Chase and Wells Fargo ( WFC - news - people ) are also testing $3 monthly debit card fees in select markets. Neither bank has said when it will make a final decision on whether to roll out the fee more broadly.

The growing prevalence of the debit card fee is alarming for Josh Wood, a 32-year-old financial adviser in Amarillo, Texas.

Wood relies entirely on debit cards to avoid interest charges on a credit card. If his bank, Wells Fargo, began charging a debit card fee, he said he would take his business to a credit union.

If a debit fee became so prevalent that it was unavoidable, Wood said he's not sure how he'd react.

"I might use all cash. Or go back to writing checks," he said.

The debit card fee isn't the only unwelcome change for checking account customers are seeing either. The banking industry has been raising fees and scaling back on rewards programs as they adjust to new regulations that will limit traditional revenue sources.

Starting Oct. 1, a regulation will cap the fees that banks can collect from merchants whenever customers swipe their debit cards. Those fees generated $19 billion in revenue for banks in 2009, according to the Nilson Report, which tracks the payments industry.

There is no similar cap on the fees that banks can collect from merchants when customers use their credit cards, however. That means banks may increasingly encourage customers to reach for their credit cards, reversing a trend toward debit card usage in the past several years.

An increasing reliance on credit cards would be particularly beneficial for Bank of America, which is a major credit card issuer, notes Bart Narter, a banking analyst with Celent, a consulting firm.

"It's become a more profitable business, at least in relation to debit cards," Narter said.

This summer, an Associated Press-GfK poll found that two-thirds of consumers use debit cards more frequently than credit cards. But when asked how they would react if they were charged a $3 monthly debit card fee, 61 percent said they'd find another way to pay.

If the fee were $5, 66 percent said they would also change their payment method.

Bank of America's debit card fee will be rolled out in stages starting with select states in early 2012. The company would not say which states would be affected first.

Bank of America shares rose 9 cents, or 1.5 percent, to $6.25 in afternoon trading.

[Joebob034]

what's the point of having a debit card if they're gonna charge you?

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I'd be pissed and I'd switch banks...I use my debit card all the time

[DemonGeminiX]

That's ridiculous.

[JoeyB]

Debit cards are often used by poor people or those trying to build credit...you know, the exact people who probably can't afford another fee.

Banks are all run by greedy assholes.

[Hal-9000]

I pay 12 bucks per month for my 'Infinity' debit card at my TD bank.As many debits as I want.

If I use a non TD automated teller to get cash, I get charged 1.50 per transaction at the ATM...and then another 1.50 on my monthly TD bank statement for non-TD ATM transactions.


With me so far? 12 bucks + let's say 10 non TD bank withdrawals = 1.50 x 10 = 1.50 x 10 = 42 dollars a month for the privilege of using my account.




:| :| :|

[DemonGeminiX]

I pay 12 bucks per month for my 'Infinity' debit card at my TD bank.As many debits as I want.

If I use a non TD automated teller to get cash, I get charged 1.50 per transaction at the ATM...and then another 1.50 on my monthly TD bank statement for non-TD ATM transactions.


With me so far? 12 bucks + let's say 10 non TD bank withdrawals = 1.50 x 10 = 1.50 x 10 = 42 dollars a month for the privilege of using my account.




:| :| :|

:-s

So how's yer bunghole feeling?

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I pay 12 bucks per month for my 'Infinity' debit card at my TD bank.As many debits as I want.

If I use a non TD automated teller to get cash, I get charged 1.50 per transaction at the ATM...and then another 1.50 on my monthly TD bank statement for non-TD ATM transactions.


With me so far? 12 bucks + let's say 10 non TD bank withdrawals = 1.50 x 10 = 1.50 x 10 = 42 dollars a month for the privilege of using my account.




:| :| :|

:shock:

[Hal-9000]

Debits are free...and I do a lot of them.

The only time I get the 1.50 hoop-rape is when I take out cash at a machine that's not affiliated with my bank.It's a standard thing up here in Canada, 1.50 for a cash transaction not at 'your' bank machine.

Then TD (Canada Trust) levies the additional non-TD charge on my monthly account.So it's pretty much 3 bucks for cash when I'm not using their machines.I am driving my own destiny...I could avoid it altogether by not being lazy and using their machines when I need cash, which isn't often.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Yeah, but the straight $12/month right off the top is BS

[Loser]

Had someone write me a check from bofa once, they wanted 15$ to cash the motherfucker because I was a non account holder...

Went to walmart, and they charged me 3$.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Had someone write me a check from bofa once, they wanted 15$ to cash the motherfucker because I was a non account holder...

Went to walmart, and they charged me 3$.

I kn bow banks charge you to cash a check if you aren't a customer, but $15 is just ridiculous

[Hal-9000]

Yeah, but the straight $12/month right off the top is BS

That's actually a good plan comparatively...they have others that are cheaper but with limited debit transactions....like 4 or 8 transactions :lol:

I do something like 40 -100 per month

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I pay nothing to use my debit card...only time I get a fee is if I use a non-TCF Bank ATM

[Hal-9000]

I pay nothing to use my debit card...only time I get a fee is if I use a non-TCF Bank ATM

This is my overall bank plan that features my debit card...so I do all normal transactions, checking, savings, pre authorized debits plus my debits.

Doesn't your bank charge you a monthly fee?

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Nope, no fee at all

[Teh One Who Knocks]

http://www.tcfbank.com/PersonalBanking/pb_checking_home.jsp

First column on the left is mine

[Hal-9000]

and yet my ass is left bloody at the end of every month...what a rip off

:x :x

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Plus TCF Bank is open 7 days a week :)

[Hal-9000]

Same with mine...

fook me us Canadians get raped on everything :sad2:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Same with mine...

fook me us Canadians get raped on everything :sad2:

:empathy:

[Hal-9000]

If I robbed a bank up here there would probably be a service charge :|

[Loser]

Funny thing is, they're only driving away customers, which will hurt them more.

If my bank charged me a monthly fee on my checking account, or charged for my debit service, I'd drop them so fast their head would spin.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I don't put all the blame on the banks for this though....that moron Durbin and his stupid bill capping the fees that banks were getting from retailers caused this. You can't expect the banks to lose a huge stream of revenue and just accept it. Anytime the government "helps" consumers, we end up getting screwed even worse.

[deebakes]

:usa:

[DemonGeminiX]

If I robbed a bank up here there would probably be a service charge :|

Dude.... :lol:

[Godfather]

That's a joke. F-that.

I've had a debit card for 15 years and only just started paying fees (students pay none). I pay about 10$ a month for services and everything. Seems a little high to me but I can live with it.



Interesting what Joey was saying though... I dono what he's talking about, I've used mine for simple every-day transactions forever just because it's fast and easier than carrying cash. Canada has had nation-wide interact direct payment for a while. I do remember going down to the US a lot and it not being very common until more recently :-k

[JoeyB]

That's a joke. F-that.

I've had a debit card for 15 years and only just started paying fees (students pay none). I pay about 10$ a month for services and everything. Seems a little high to me but I can live with it.



Interesting what Joey was saying though... I dono what he's talking about, I've used mine for simple every-day transactions forever just because it's fast and easier than carrying cash. Canada has had nation-wide interact direct payment for a while. I do remember going down to the US a lot and it not being very common until more recently :-k

I was just referring to the fact that for a lot of poor people, or those trying to establish credit, that debit cards are the only option they have. And to people such as that, fees can be devastating.

[Godfather]

Ahh too true eh.

Damn it's terrible but ever since I got a Visa Points card a few months back (again, before I had Student Visa, no points but it was free), I've put EVERYTHING on it that I can :lol:

That bill is heartbreaking sometimes, but hey... I almost have enough points to buy a keychain or tic-tacs. :lol:

[Acid Trip]

Debit cards are often used by poor people or those trying to build credit

:wtf: Debit cards don't help you build credit. Where did you get that nonsense from?

[Acid Trip]

As someone who runs several banks here is some advice. If your bank does ANY of the following then CLOSE YOUR ACCOUNTS!

1) If you get charged a monthly fee to have or use a debit card
2) If there is a monthly fee just for having a demand deposit account (aka checking)
3) If you withdraw money from an ATM that your bank doesn't own your bank should not charge you, only the bank who owns it can should charge you (US only)
4) If you are limited on the number of withdraws from your demand deposit account (aka checking)
5) If you get charged for online banking, bill pay, or e-statements

All of these services should be FREE! No exceptions!

[Muddy]

I don't pay any fees including for money orders. They know if they fuck with me, I'll start moving accounts..

Now back to the original post... Does the fee still get charged if you use the ATM card as a 'credit card' vs the 'debit function'? Even thought they both draw off the same account.

[Acid Trip]

I don't pay any fees including for money orders. They know if they fuck with me, I'll start moving accounts..

Now back to the original post... Does the fee still get charged if you use the ATM card as a 'credit card' vs the 'debit function'? Even thought they both draw off the same account.

Yes. If you use your card in any way other than to withdraw cash from an ATM you will be charged a $5 fee that month.

[Muddy]

Yes. If you use your card in any way other than to withdraw cash from an ATM you will be charged a $5 fee that month.


What a fuckin' crock.. I guarantee this will hurt their business...

[Teh One Who Knocks]

What a fuckin' crock.. I guarantee this will hurt their business...

Unless all the banks start doing it...

[Muddy]

They better hope the other banks jump on board quickly...

[Acid Trip]

What a fuckin' crock.. I guarantee this will hurt their business...

Hopefully this will be a wake up call for millions of Americans. If the fact all the big banks got bailed out with tax dollars didn't make someone close their accounts maybe this $5 fee will.

My bank was hoping the big banks came tumbling down in 2008 so we could buy their assets for pennies on the dollar. The bailouts fucked that up though.

[Muddy]

I use Suntrust for checking and such and they seem to be pretty solid..

[Hal-9000]

As someone who runs several banks here is some advice. If your bank does ANY of the following then CLOSE YOUR ACCOUNTS!

1) If you get charged a monthly fee to have or use a debit card
2) If there is a monthly fee just for having a demand deposit account (aka checking)
3) If you withdraw money from an ATM that your bank doesn't own your bank should not charge you, only the bank who owns it can should charge you (US only)
4) If you are limited on the number of withdraws from your demand deposit account (aka checking)
5) If you get charged for online banking, bill pay, or e-statements

All of these services should be FREE! No exceptions!

TD Canada Trust, one of the biggest institutions up here.

Do you wanna send them a letter on my behalf? The whole country is getting charged this way on points you list.You put US only for #3, we get charged both by the ATM provider and then our bank as well.

[Hal-9000]

That's a joke. F-that.

I've had a debit card for 15 years and only just started paying fees (students pay none). I pay about 10$ a month for services and everything. Seems a little high to me but I can live with it.



Interesting what Joey was saying though... I dono what he's talking about, I've used mine for simple every-day transactions forever just because it's fast and easier than carrying cash. Canada has had nation-wide interact direct payment for a while. I do remember going down to the US a lot and it not being very common until more recently :-k

I'm with TD....I'll post my monthly fees so you can stop your 10 dollar whining :lol:

[Hal-9000]

Guess who will be calling his bank this weekend :lol:

30 dollars for the privilege of using their services last month...holy crapfuck

http://i53.tinypic.com/ad2t0w.jpg

[Muddy]

Guess who will be calling his bank this weekend :lol:

30 dollars for the privilege of using their services last month...holy crapfuck

http://i53.tinypic.com/ad2t0w.jpg

I have one checking account where they actually pay me interest on the money I have... :dance:

[Acid Trip]

TD Canada Trust, one of the biggest institutions up here.

Do you wanna send them a letter on my behalf? The whole country is getting charged this way on points you list.You put US only for #3, we get charged both by the ATM provider and then our bank as well.

In the United States that was called that double dipping and it was outlawed. Why should your bank charge you $1.50 when you pulled the money out from some other bank's ATM? The other bank has to refill the ATM and such so the cost is warranted. To your bank it's just a regular withdraw.

Look at community banks where you live and a better deal should be easily available. Big banks = bad. TD Canada Trust sounds like the Canadian version of BofA.

[Hal-9000]

I have to pay the 14.95 fee to use the account overall.....checking and unlimited debits.
I have to pay the 3.00 overdraft protection as well so I pay 18/month not matter what.

the 'other bank' fees is where I'm getting raped and that's my fault using ATM's for cash that aren't 'my bank' machines....

what a racket they got going up here...

[Acid Trip]

I have one checking account where they actually pay me interest on the money I have... :dance:

There are online checking/savings accounts that pay better than most brick and mortar banks. ING Direct pays .25% on checking accounts and 1% on savings. It links to your current bank using electronic transfers so moving money between them is easy.

[Acid Trip]

I have to pay the 14.95 fee to use the account overall.....checking and unlimited debits.
I have to pay the 3.00 overdraft protection as well so I pay 18/month not matter what.

the 'other bank' fees is where I'm getting raped and that's my fault using ATM's for cash that aren't 'my bank' machines....

what a racket they got going up here...

They charge you for overdraft protection?!?! Hahahahaha :rofl: :lmao: You Canadians are getting raped by your banks. How does it feel?

Our over draft protection is free but you are charged for each over draft you commit. If you never overdraft you never pay any fee.

[Hal-9000]

:sad2: sure, laugh it up while Bubba slides his 18 incher up my butt.....MONTHLY!


:x

[Muddy]

There are online checking/savings accounts that pay better than most brick and mortar banks. ING Direct pays .25% on checking accounts and 1% on savings. It links to your current bank using electronic transfers so moving money between them is easy.


I think this is around .65%..

[Joebob034]

do they at least kiss you first Hal?

[Hal-9000]

I should be getting bi yearly blowjobs for those fees Joebob...but alas, no :sad2:

[JoeyB]

I was just referring to the fact that for a lot of poor people, or those trying to establish credit, that debit cards are the only option they have. And to people such as that, fees can be devastating.


:wtf: Debit cards don't help you build credit. Where did you get that nonsense from?

I never said debit cards build credit, though there are isolated cases where you can use them for that purpose.

What I'm saying is that debit cards are often used by poor people or those trying to build credit...in other words, those who do not have the option of using a credit card as they would not qualify for one. My other point is that those two groups of people often have limited income and can hardly afford another fee.

[deebakes]

http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd53/grngorilla/snarf.gif

[FBD]

ok - do any of you get that this is a direct result of dodd-frank? which sought to "protect consumers" by "limiting how much they could charge" and then...surprise, they turn around and find another way to recoup the money.

so if you're pissed about this, call up bawney fwank's office and tell him to fcuk off.

[JoeyB]

ok - do any of you get that this is a direct result of dodd-frank? which sought to "protect consumers" by "limiting how much they could charge" and then...surprise, they turn around and find another way to recoup the money.

so if you're pissed about this, call up bawney fwank's office and tell him to fcuk off.

How exactly would that be Frank's fault? He sought to protect consumers from abusive fees...and then the banks find another way to charge people, because banks are all run by greedy assholes. At least Frank is trying to protect consumers. If you're pissed about this, tell your bank. Not the people who are trying to help you.

[FBD]

:lol: Really? Noffense man, but that interpretation doesnt come to grips with reality. I dont know if you read what the legislation said, it limited the amount of fees that could be charged for credit card purchases - by and large those fees are between the business and the credit card company! If anything, the business in the middle was somewhat left out, and the legislation was only targeting "the big bad credit card company" and the verbiage was only specific to CC purchases, and not debit cards. where is that "protecting consumers?"

That's part of how laws & regulations get so damned complex, because legislators are always five steps behind.

If I have a business and some dumbass legislator gets an idea in his head that I'm making too much money - even though my profit margin isnt exactly super high to begin with - and writes a law that limits certain areas of my income - it doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure out that as a business owner I am going to simply shift the balance of profits somewhere else to recoup the penalty incurred by the government - "fcuk my customers over in a different fashion" (if you want to take the poor-victim-consumer mindset,) and in some cases, its not just a 'would like to'...if your profit margin is small then recouping costs winds up becoming an absolute necessity if you want to keep your doors open - so in other words, Barney Frank fcuked over everyone that uses debit cards by putting a penalty on credit card purchases, while maintaining the air of having done something positive - which is a dubious position at best, since the real world effects are what I'm focused on and not what the intended effect the legislator had when he crafted the junk in the first place. I dont care if his heart was in the right spot, what are the results?

That's behind the push some have to simply get rid of corporate taxes - because any expense incurred on a business by the government WILL get passed on to the customer in some way, shape, or form. Its just a simple law of the jungle, man. The cost of a product or service is reflective of the cumulative expenses put into producing the product or service. Bawney raised those expenses, and they got passed on to the consumers just like any rational objective assessment would dictate.


Correction on the particular credit card portion: Durbin. Getting called out by the chicago tribune :lol:
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/editorials/ct-edit-durbin-20111001,0,6136347.story


Get ready to pay the Durbin Fee
What happens when government picks who will profit

en. Dick Durbin must be forgetting that once you've dug yourself into a deep hole, you'd best stop shoveling.

How else to explain the Illinois Democrat's blustery reaction to the $5 a month that Bank of America Corp. plans to charge some of its customers who use debit cards? The charge, which other banks are likely to adopt, is a direct result of his lawmaking. Call it the Durbin Fee.

Last year, Durbin pushed an amendment to the Dodd-Frank financial regulation package that imposes a sharp cut in interchange fees, which banks charge retailers every time a customer swipes a bank debit card to buy something. That rule goes into effect Saturday. In essence, this strips money from banks and hands it to retailers, who will pay sharply lower fees. There's no guarantee that retailers will pass the savings on to customers.

Bankers told Durbin and his fellow lawmakers last year that the interchange fees subsidize free checking accounts and other services, including the convenient practice of making purchases with debit cards at no charge to the buyer. Slash fees to retailers, the banks said, and they would likely recoup the lost revenue by charging their customers for use of the cards. That's exactly what's happening now.

Durbin claimed that a cut in interchange fees would translate into lower prices and better service at Walmart and 7-Eleven. Funny, but no one's handed us a free Slurpee yet. In fact, the chief financial officer of Home Depot told Wall Street analysts in a conference call earlier this year that she expected Durbin's efforts to result in a $35 million annual "benefit" to the retailer.

Having picked sides in a high-stakes business deal—retailers over banks—Durbin denounced Bank of America for the widely telegraphed result. "Bank of America is trying to find new ways to pad its profits by sticking it to its customers," he said.

Shockingly, banks seek to be profitable. Durbin sought to transfer some profits from banks to retailers. The banks are trying to recoup the lost earnings.

Result of the government intervention: Retailers win, banks lose, and you get to pay the Durbin Fee.

:lol: I love it when a plan comes together. Doh!!! In "protecting consumers" it is exactly they whom are punished most.

[JoeyB]

So if you get raped in the jail shower, and the guards make it so that you cannot be raped in the jail shower, you'll blame the guards when you get raped somewhere else?

Wake up and blame the rapists.

[FBD]

Yeah, but unlike the jailhouse, you have a choice whether to participate or not in this one :lol:

I know it would be awesome if everything in the world were free, but it aint the year 5219 yet. We've got quite a ways to go before energy is more abundantly available than we can put to use and all of the normal notions of work are obsolete.

So when you utilize a company for a service, you're going to pay for it, or are you not in favor of letting a business charge money for something, lest it be considered rape? Rhetorical question. "You got done a favor" in "protection" that actually costs you more and does the opposite of what the legislation was intended to do. How's that style of government working out for you?

Bitch about how the world works instead of paddling a little more with the current?

[Acid Trip]

How exactly would that be Frank's fault? He sought to protect consumers from abusive fees...and then the banks find another way to charge people, because banks are all run by greedy assholes. At least Frank is trying to protect consumers. If you're pissed about this, tell your bank. Not the people who are trying to help you.

You don't get it do you?

Dodd-Frank limited the transaction fees that banks make when people use their cards. Banks used those transaction fees to give customers "free" things like debit cards, online banking, mobile banking, e-statements, free checking accounts, free checks for life, and so on. I say there are free because your bank gave them to you as a customer with no monthly fees. It was all paid for by you swiping your card at businesses.

So who was paying these transaction fees? The businesses who accepted the cards. It never hurt you the consumer at all. Now the businesses pay less and who pays more? You do. Did the price of everything go down when transaction fees went down? Nope, businesses now pocket the difference between the old fee and the new fee as pure profit. So much for helping the consumer.

I wouldn't expect someone who has never run a business to understand how business works. After all that's why Obama is such a screw up.

[JoeyB]

You don't get it do you?

I love that you never get it...or get that despite your mining of information on the web to support your little positions, that I often just post shit to watch your head spin, as you seem obsessed with me and obsessed with nit picking everything I write.

After you started doing that a couple of months ago, I started toying with you.

It was fun for awhile, now I'm bored with you. Go back to watching your Fox news. I'm gonna go back to sending suggestive PM's to Jez...I think he's grown lonely and jealous.

[Acid Trip]

I love that you never get it...or get that despite your mining of information on the web to support your little positions, that I often just post shit to watch your head spin, as you seem obsessed with me and obsessed with nit picking everything I write.

After you started doing that a couple of months ago, I started toying with you.

It was fun for awhile, now I'm bored with you. Go back to watching your Fox news. I'm gonna go back to sending suggestive PM's to Jez...I think he's grown lonely and jealous.

I read, I understood, and now all I can think is...

http://alvonia.fatcow.com/store/media/encouragement_incarcerated/ss_size1/You%20Got%20Schooled.JPG

[JoeyB]

I read, I understood, and now all I can think is...

Ahh brilliantly clueless as ever. Bravo! Bravo!

But seriously, I'm not sure when you picked me as your pet project, but once you started nitpicking me all the time I had to single you out in return.

Don't feel threatened, which you clearly are. Just walk away and go back to your dream world of Fox news porn.

It's where you belong my friend. You won't be happy anywhere else.

PS: As much as I love toying with you, now that I've revealed my game I won't be playing anymore. So, if you feel motivated to continue to snipe at me, you might find it a lonely pursuit.

[Hal-9000]

I've decided that I'm going to hang out by my bank's ATM at night, breath heavily and ask other patrons if they like getting raped too?

stay tuned for feedback and possible pics of the action :face:

[JoeyB]

Possible pics?

Possible?

There had better be pics.

[Hal-9000]

Of course there will be a gallery...featuring yours truly getting the shit kicked out of him :thumbsup:

Women at late night ATM's seem to lose their sense of humor for some reason..

[JoeyB]

Especially if you swipe your card down the crack of their ass and then attempt to input your access code.

[Acid Trip]

Ahh brilliantly clueless as ever. Bravo! Bravo!

But seriously, I'm not sure when you picked me as your pet project, but once you started nitpicking me all the time I had to single you out in return.

Don't feel threatened, which you clearly are. Just walk away and go back to your dream world of Fox news porn.

It's where you belong my friend. You won't be happy anywhere else.

PS: As much as I love toying with you, now that I've revealed my game I won't be playing anymore. So, if you feel motivated to continue to snipe at me, you might find it a lonely pursuit.

Feel threatened? Please. You give yourself way too much credit. First you think you can make my head spin with mindless dribble and now you think I'm threatened by you.

The population of Fantasy Land just went up by 1. Enjoy your stay.

[Hal-9000]

Especially if you swipe your card down the crack of their ass and then attempt to input your access code.

Or fill an envelope and attempt to make a deposit...

[Muddy]

Happy 1000 posts AT.. I noticed your name changed colors! :dance:

[FBD]

I love that you never get it...or get that despite your mining of information on the web to support your little positions, that I often just post shit to watch your head spin, as you seem obsessed with me and obsessed with nit picking everything I write.

After you started doing that a couple of months ago, I started toying with you.

It was fun for awhile, now I'm bored with you. Go back to watching your Fox news. I'm gonna go back to sending suggestive PM's to Jez...I think he's grown lonely and jealous.

:lol: head spin...the only spin here's your words, bro.

you post up your position, we shoot it full of holes, you reiterate it again but just a little differently, we shoot it full of holes again, then you turn around and say you're toying with us?


:rofl: it would be more honest to just admit you dont have much of a foundation for some of the beliefs you hold. its easier than showing us all the "oh...jeez....I didnt think of that..." face, and then still somehow claiming to be right. :razz:

[JoeyB]

:lol: head spin...the only spin here's your words, bro.

you post up your position, we shoot it full of holes, you reiterate it again but just a little differently, we shoot it full of holes again, then you turn around and say you're toying with us?


:rofl: it would be more honest to just admit you dont have much of a foundation for some of the beliefs you hold. its easier than showing us all the "oh...jeez....I didnt think of that..." face, and then still somehow claiming to be right. :razz:

My points have not been shot full of holes. I used humor to make a valid point that he ignored completely because he is incapable of seeing anything that wasn't told to him by fox news. And yes, I also used humor because I like to make him jumpy. What of it?

And I find it amusing that I point out to acid that he does nothing but post other people's thoughts, and then he turns around and posts a picture from the web as his rebuttal.

That...is fucking hilarious.

I do take offense to one thing you said...about my beliefs. I am a person who examines things quite closely, sometimes for years, and my views stem from observation, intellect, and compassion. I do not appreciate 'like think' and those who employ it. I do feel there are a number of people on this forum who are nothing but mindless drones, spitting out rhetoric from whatever radio show they last heard and thinking it somehow makes them thoughtful. I realize this is a very right wing area and my views are not in form with what many of you see, but my views are arrived at carefully and with reason.

And when Acid starting sniping at me a couple of months back, which came out of the blue (possible font joke alert!) as I really had little contact with him here, I was not only taken aback but also slightly perplexed. So...I started riling him up. Seems fair, he decides to follow me around sniping at everything I say, so I fuck with him in return.

[Muddy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RO10s_HK6d0

[FBD]

How exactly would that be Frank's fault? He sought to protect consumers from abusive fees...and then the banks find another way to charge people, because banks are all run by greedy assholes. At least Frank is trying to protect consumers. If you're pissed about this, tell your bank. Not the people who are trying to help you.

Sorry man, this right here got shot full of more holes than the side of a redneck's barn.

Simply repeating to oneself "I'm right, I'm right, I didnt get pwned" doesnt make it so. Sorry, that's probably a bit too much. My point is, your shit did get owned on this one - you were flat out wrong, you had zero for a rebuttal, and your sarcasm doesnt make any point.

Just because a company provides one of their many services for free doesnt mean it will always be free, it doesnt mean its rape if they rescind that.

This place aint all right wingey, though acid and I are rather conservative, right-wing isnt an accurate descriptor - but that doesnt usually stop people with leftist views...and I'll stop that bit right there.

Its ok to admit when you didnt fully consider something, man.

[JoeyB]

Sorry man, this right here got shot full of more holes than the side of a redneck's barn.

Simply repeating to oneself "I'm right, I'm right, I didnt get pwned" doesnt make it so. Sorry, that's probably a bit too much. My point is, your shit did get owned on this one - you were flat out wrong, you had zero for a rebuttal, and your sarcasm doesnt make any point.

Just because a company provides one of their many services for free doesnt mean it will always be free, it doesnt mean its rape if they rescind that.

This place aint all right wingey, though acid and I are rather conservative, right-wing isnt an accurate descriptor - but that doesnt usually stop people with leftist views...and I'll stop that bit right there.

Its ok to admit when you didnt fully consider something, man.

Umm, I still say my point is valid. Just because you can't see it doesn't invalidate it. Cutting and pasting a bunch of right wing BS to support your point doesn't make it 'right', it just makes you good at cutting and pasting. Congratulations to Acid for mastering cut and paste.

You want to argue this back and forth for another three pages?

I don't.

And it's alright to admit you are not always right FBD. Even though it was actually Acid who was wrong, but whatever, you want in on it, help yourself. There is enough crazy for everyone.

EDIT: I am done here, you two go ahead and have your parting shots at my post and high five each other and wank to some pictures of soldiers killing people. I concede the last word to you so as to end the nonsense.

[DemonGeminiX]

Enough.

[Hal-9000]

Yeah let's return to making fun of hal for having to pay 1000/ month for bloody bank charges :x

I have a question because I'm lazy....does this article mean you guys would pay 5 bucks per debit transaction or 5 bucks per month for using the debit system in general?

[DemonGeminiX]

Yeah let's return to making fun of hal for having to pay 1000/ month for bloody bank charges :x

I have a question because I'm lazy....does this article mean you guys would pay 5 bucks per debit transaction or 5 bucks per month for using the debit system in general?

I think it's the latter monthly charge.

[Muddy]

Yeah let's return to making fun of hal for having to pay 1000/ month for bloody bank charges :x

I have a question because I'm lazy....does this article mean you guys would pay 5 bucks per debit transaction or 5 bucks per month for using the debit system in general?


I dont pay shit, Homie... :lol:

[JoeyB]

It says the fee only applies if you use the debit card for purchases, but that if no activity takes place no fee will appear. Also, you can use the card for ATM without penalty.

But, an ATM card is an ATM card. The beauty of the debit card is the ability to make purchases, as if it were a credit card. I actually thought that was the primary purpose of a debit card...to have a something that functions like a credit card.

Quick question...on a credit card purchase, the store actually loses a bit as opposed to a cash transaction, because there is a fee they pay to the credit card company.

So, is that same tiny fee not also applied to debit card purchases?

And if so, is also charging the consumer this $5 fee not essentially the credit card companies double dipping?

[Hal-9000]

I dont pay shit, Homie... :lol:

This is what I keep hearing....there must be a caveat that says you have carry a certain balance monthly in their bank.Otherwise, how do they make money?

[Hal-9000]

I think it's the latter monthly charge.


So the big bitch is paying 5 bucks a month?? FFS I burn more bandwidth than that in one day downloading stuff :lol:
Or is the bitch the politics behind the potential fee? :rolleyes:

:opencanofworms:

[Hal-9000]

It says the fee only applies if you use the debit card for purchases, but that if no activity takes place no fee will appear. Also, you can use the card for ATM without penalty.

But, an ATM card is an ATM card. The beauty of the debit card is the ability to make purchases, as if it were a credit card. I actually thought that was the primary purpose of a debit card...to have a something that functions like a credit card.

Quick question...on a credit card purchase, the store actually loses a bit as opposed to a cash transaction, because there is a fee they pay to the credit card company.

So, is that same tiny fee not also applied to debit card purchases?

And if so, is also charging the consumer this $5 fee not essentially the credit card companies double dipping?

You...have hit the Canadian nail on the head.Like credit cards, every time a debit is transacted, the company pays a small fee to the bank.At least this is the excuse we are told up here.

In the end, companies like Your Bank and Visa always some out ahead.They're like the house in a casino.I'm going to call my bank tomorrow and level some questions about monthly fees and debits.

Will report back with the rhetoric they try and fill my head with :face:

[Muddy]

Otherwise, how do they make money?

In theory they are supposed to make investments with a portion of the bulk they hold in their accounts and earn interest on it...

[Hal-9000]

In theory they are supposed to make investments with a portion of the bulk they hold in their accounts and earn interest on it...

But what I'm asking is what kind of onus is on you? In order for them to give all these 'free' accounts away, you must have to guarantee that your account will always have 500 dollars in it for example.

Otherwise I could go rent Porky's basement out, sign up at the Bank of Cali and hold a balance of 1.29 and still get free monthly banking and privileges?

[Muddy]

But what I'm asking is what kind of onus is on you? In order for them to give all these 'free' accounts away, you must have to guarantee that your account will always have 500 dollars in it for example.

Otherwise I could go rent Porky's basement out, sign up at the Bank of Cali and hold a balance of 1.29 and still get free monthly banking and privileges?


I think my account requires $500 or $1500 Minimum balance or something to get the freebies..

[JoeyB]

You...have hit the Canadian nail on the head.Like credit cards, every time a debit is transacted, the company pays a small fee to the bank.At least this is the excuse we are told up here.

In the end, companies like Your Bank and Visa always some out ahead.They're like the house in a casino.I'm going to call my bank tomorrow and level some questions about monthly fees and debits.

Will report back with the rhetoric they try and fill my head with :face:


But what I'm asking is what kind of onus is on you? In order for them to give all these 'free' accounts away, you must have to guarantee that your account will always have 500 dollars in it for example.

Otherwise I could go rent Porky's basement out, sign up at the Bank of Cali and hold a balance of 1.29 and still get free monthly banking and privileges?

There is no onus...that's the thing...the fees they charge people are just pure profit for the sake of greed. It's free because of the money they collect from retailers, which is a lot, (a lot!)...they rake cash in hand over mouth. Which is why certain legislation I will not mention for fear of upsetting certain people who will go nameless was enacted. Some politicians wanted to stop the banks from being greedy. The fact that the banks just found new ways to be greedy does not in anyway invalidate the earlier effort to curb their behavior.The reason retailers pay credit card fees is that if they refused, and did not accept such cards, many people would shop elsewhere. So what choice do they have...pay the huge fees or lose business.

Now, since it is on the backend, on the money the retailers pay, that the credit card companies make their cash...it only makes sense to make their cards as ubiquitous as possible...the more people who use those cards, the higher the fees they can charge to retailers without the retailers being able to revolt.

Charging fees to consumers is becoming popular only because of a curious side effect...credit cards have in the last fifty years gone from being rare to being so commonplace that for many it is difficult to live without them. So, the banks figure they can start making more and more money off both ends because of this...and so you'll see more fees directly to consumers...especially those who are poor and use services for which there are few other options.

But, what do I know? I apparently do not think things through and need to admit I am wrong.

(Oh and all these retailer fees is why I was asking my other question, because only if they charged retailers nothing would charging people a fee make sense.)

EDIT: Oh and, "But what I'm asking is what kind of onus is on you? In order for them to give all these 'free' accounts away" my whole point was they need you to have those accounts. There is no onus because you have to be out there using those cards for them to make money.

To put it another way...if every time you shit in the woods the park had to pay the banks a buck, would you not think the banks would be handing out free 'shit in the park' passes all day long?

[Hal-9000]

I think my account requires $500 or $1500 Minimum balance or something to get the freebies..

Yeah I think part of Lance's is written that way too.They have to be able to play with your money while giving you the various activities.

[Muddy]

I have one called Super Interest checking that the bigger your balance the more of a percentage they will pay you..

[Hal-9000]

I have one called Super Interest checking that the bigger your balance the more of a percentage they will pay you..

They're probably using all youse guy's money to finance gun shipments and drugs from Bolivia

[FBD]

Umm, I still say my point is valid.

:lol: and here I erased the part about you having a nice little worldview selectively constructed :nana:

/hi-5s AT

/signs off

[Hal-9000]

I'm just going to go back to doing what I did when I was 17...no bank account, cashed every check at the Co-Op post office and carry around the whole works in my pocket for 2 weeks :lol:

[JoeyB]

carry around the whole works in my pocket for 2 weeks :lol:

What public areas do you like to hang out in, preferably dark alleyways or parks with no other people. And in an unrelated matter, would you say you have good hearing, or could someone carrying a shovel easily sneak up behind you?

[Hal-9000]

What public areas do you like to hang out in, preferably dark alleyways or parks with no other people. And in an unrelated matter, would you say you have good hearing, or could someone carrying a shovel easily sneak up behind you?

Are you kidding? When I have that much green on me I hang out on 7th avenue and go for what I like to call - The 10 tooth threesome for under 50 bucks.I can get 3 crack ho's for a discount and then it's party time with Papa-hal :afro:

[JoeyB]

Are you kidding? When I have that much green on me I hang out on 7th avenue and go for what I like to call - The 10 tooth threesome for under 50 bucks.I can get 3 crack ho's for a discount and then it's party time with Papa-hal :afro:

Disco Hal doing chickenhead crack hos. That could be an entire porn series, until you died of the AIDS of course.

[lost in melb.]

Debits are free...and I do a lot of them.

The only time I get the 1.50 hoop-rape is when I take out cash at a machine that's not affiliated with my bank.It's a standard thing up here in Canada, 1.50 for a cash transaction not at 'your' bank machine.

Then TD (Canada Trust) levies the additional non-TD charge on my monthly account.So it's pretty much 3 bucks for cash when I'm not using their machines.I am driving my own destiny...I could avoid it altogether by not being lazy and using their machines when I need cash, which isn't often.

2 bucks a withdrawal here [-(

[lost in melb.]

2 bucks a withdrawal here [-(

unless you blow them

[DemonGeminiX]

^^^

That doesn't work unless the post background is white.

[Acid Trip]

It says the fee only applies if you use the debit card for purchases, but that if no activity takes place no fee will appear. Also, you can use the card for ATM without penalty.

But, an ATM card is an ATM card. The beauty of the debit card is the ability to make purchases, as if it were a credit card. I actually thought that was the primary purpose of a debit card...to have a something that functions like a credit card.

Quick question...on a credit card purchase, the store actually loses a bit as opposed to a cash transaction, because there is a fee they pay to the credit card company.

So, is that same tiny fee not also applied to debit card purchases?

And if so, is also charging the consumer this $5 fee not essentially the credit card companies double dipping?

I'll answer your questions even though you won't probably read it. First off the fee isn't "tiny". All fees are calculated before taxes.

Visa/Mastercard charge businesses approx 2 to 2.5% of the sale price as their fee.

Discover/American express charge about 3-4% as their fee (which is why they aren't as widely accepted).

When a debit card is used the fee is actually lower than any of the credit card fees the credit card companies charge you (used to be about 1 to 1.5%). That is why businesses prefer that you use debit over credit. The fee from a debit card goes straight to the bank named on the card and not the credit card company whose icon appears on your card. Debit cards were one of the primary revenue streams for banks of all sizes.

I hereby certify that nothing in this entire discussion from page 1 till now has been copy/pasted (other than the picture).

[JoeyB]

I'll answer your questions even though you won't probably read it. First off the fee isn't "tiny". All fees are calculated before taxes.

I always read everything in a conversation I am involved in. Why would you assume otherwise?

And it was always my impression that the fee is also sliding, meaning that a trivial purchase will result in something of a base fee that will wind up costing the store a much larger percentage. But that is a lingering bit of data from a high school teacher and I graduated a long, long time ago.

And I based my statement of a fee on a generic 3% average.

And everything you quoted was tinged with a bit of facetiousness in regards to the actions of the credit card companies, in case you missed it.

[Hal-9000]

2 bucks a withdrawal here [-(


unless you blow them

:lol:

[FBD]

Joey, are you concerned about the store, or the customers?

Remember, its that evil businessman that used to pay that fee that you now have to pay, if your bank is B of A.

And now, they're of course getting political punishment-payback from the very originator of that amendment - Durbin is now telling people "if you do business with BoA, get the hell out of there!" Which is absolutely fucked up because this asshole is trying to cover the downstream results of his actions and like a true democrat is dancing like mad to try and keep the shit from sticking to his fur.

[Acid Trip]

Citi has now joined the fray of new fees. If you don't keep a collective $16,000 in your accounts they'll charge you $20 a month for your account. Close your big bank accounts and head to your local/regional bank or credit union!

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Citi-announces-new-fees-on-cnnm-215283525.html?x=0

Citi announces new fees on checking accounts

The fees keep coming. Citi is the latest big bank to slap customers with a round of fee hikes. This time, on its checking accounts.

Starting in December, customers who hold its mid-level Citibank Account will be charged $20 a month if they fail to maintain a minimum balance of $15,000 in their combined accounts. Previously, account holders had to carry a minimum balance of $6,000.

At the same time, customers who have the bank's EZ Checking account will start being charged $15 a month if they don't carry a minimum balance of $6,000. Citi (C) says it is phasing out the EZ Checking package, which currently carries no monthly fee, and is instead offering customers either the Citibank Account or its Basic Banking account, which also carries a fee.

Last month, Citi said it is hiking the fee on its Basic Banking account from $8 to $10. Customers will be able to avoid paying the $10 fee by either maintaining a minimum balance of $1,500 or by making one direct deposit and one automatic online payment through their checking account each month, said Citi.

Currently, account holders must make five online transactions per month in order to avoid paying the fee and there is no minimum balance requirement.

Citi's fee hikes come just days after Bank of America announced it would charge a $5 fee for debit card purchases. Wells Fargo, JPMorgan Chase, Sun Trust and Regions Financial have all also rolled out similar fees in select markets in recent weeks.

"The regulatory environment has changed a great deal -- particularly with the Durbin Amendment -- and we're seeing the results of that now," said Claes Bell, banking reporter with Bankrate.com. Going forward, "we're going to see more large national banks announce fees."

With the new regulation that caps how much revenue banks can get from the swipe fees they collect from merchants, banks must look for other ways to cover that lost income, explained Nessa Feddis, vice president and senior counsel of the American Bankers Association.

"We don't expect to pay nothing to ride the train, it's the same thing with a checking account," she said.

Citibank said it chose not to charge a debit card fee because its customers did not want it. "There's a reason why we structured it this way," said Catherine Pulley, spokeswoman for Citi. There are also no hidden fees, Pulley added, and customers will benefit from free online bill pay and free access to non-Citi ATM machines.

While the majority of checking accounts were free last year, less than half now come without a price tag, according to a recent study from bank-comparison site Bankrate, which looked at 243 interest and 238 non-interest accounts.

Like Citi's new offerings, 92% of checking accounts have fee waivers, meaning that if you can meet certain financially requirements, most checking accounts are -- or could become -- free.

[JoeyB]

Joey, are you concerned about the store, or the customers?

Remember, its that evil businessman that used to pay that fee that you now have to pay, if your bank is B of A.

And now, they're of course getting political punishment-payback from the very originator of that amendment - Durbin is now telling people "if you do business with BoA, get the hell out of there!" Which is absolutely fucked up because this asshole is trying to cover the downstream results of his actions and like a true democrat is dancing like mad to try and keep the shit from sticking to his fur.

Again, endlessly posting Fox News approved anti-liberal bias does not change the reality of the situation. I was right, you were wrong. Though, if you'd prefer I can employ your tactic, post somebody else's opinion and claim to have p-owned you.

So on that accord, in reference to the $5 a month charge:

"This new debit card fee would bring Bank of America $2 billion a year in new profits."

See, profits. Not covering of expenses necessary to maintain business. Profits.

They just want more cash people, which should have been obvious.

I have now p-owned everyone in this thread and also Lady Gaga, for no reason at all other than I just wanted to mention her.

[FBD]

Red Herring. If my company makes X in profit and the government decides to punish me X-5, then I am going to look for a way to make up that 5. Does it not occur to you that it is part of the business' responsibility to produce profit? If no profit is produced, where is the incentive for anyone to invest in a NON profitable venture?

So your whole notion of "they're just greedy" is a crock of shit.

So if something isnt as profitable, then investment declines. Investment declines, and...look around, that's a di-rect downstream result of the Obama Admin. That is the reason we have seen no recovery, even though we're "2 years in." 'Splain to me why businesses have all this cash yet there's no hiring? Splain to me why the recovery has not happened?

The problem with debating you on these things is, when your argument falls apart you ignore it and still claim you're right. Unfortunately for your fantasies, there is a structure of the world in place and that means certain actions will impart certain outcomes. You're trying to say these outcomes are from...businesses making too much profit? Banks gave out bad loans? Why would they do such a thing? Simple. Take a look upstream and be honest with yourself and you plainly see the government punishing businesses and claiming its to help the people, when in reality it is but the politically connected that get the real gravy. (see things like Solyndra or look at where subsidies go.)

You cant pwn when you have no fundamental understanding of a sich, bro. Unless you're talking about pwning the shitty side of the stick.

[JoeyB]

Red Herring.

Obviously we will never agree. But I do love that every post of your drips Fox News.

[Acid Trip]

Obviously we will never agree. But I do love that every post of your drips Fox News.

Is saying that someone watches Fox News like the ultimate insult for you to pass out? Your complete obsession with Fox is a little strange.

I don't get my news from Fox or any other TV station if I can help it. I can read news faster than any stupid reporter can speak. My posts come from the Washington Examiner, the Wall Street Journal, Reuters, AP, etc. Where do you get all your "facts" again?

[Noilly Pratt]

Same with mine...

fook me us Canadians get raped on everything :sad2:

Yes, we do. I'm making the move to a Credit Union...if you ask them nicely, they'll set it all up for you, everything you had at your bank (lines of credit for less etc), and zero fees.

I didn't realize until this thread that the US has no fee debit cards either.

[Muddy]

We have debit fees when you withdraw money from someone other than your banks machines...

[Muddy]

Is saying that someone watches Fox News like the ultimate insult for you to pass out? Your complete obsession with Fox is a little strange.

I don't get my news from Fox or any other TV station if I can help it. I can read news faster than any stupid reporter can speak. My posts come from the Washington Examiner, the Wall Street Journal, Reuters, AP, etc. Where do you get all your "facts" again?

You get your news from one place... The Drudge Report

gtfo of here with your ol' yellow Corvette.

[Acid Trip]

You get your news from one place... The Drudge Report

gtfo of here with your ol' yellow Corvette.

Drudge Report isn't a news outlet. It simply links news stories from other sites (like the ones I mentioned). Nice try though.

[Muddy]

Drudge Report isn't a news outlet. It simply links news stories from other sites (like the ones I mentioned). Nice try though.


It's not an attempt, it's a slam dunk. And it's also where you source all your news stories from. It's as one sided a source as Fox News... Isn't Matt getting married to Ann Coulter or some shit?

[Acid Trip]

It's not an attempt, it's a slam dunk. And it's also where you source all your news stories from. It's as one sided a source as Fox News... Isn't Matt getting married to Ann Coulter or some shit?

It's where I source some of my news stories yes, but it's not a news outlet. How would you know a story came from Drudge or if I was on the Washington Examiner site? You wouldn't because it's a Washington Examiner story, not Drudge. Drudge doesn't make or report news it only links to stories already published.

ABC/CBS/Rueters/AP are outlets that report news. Drudge simply links to some of those news outlets among others. Keep thinking you are right if it makes you feel better.

[Muddy]

It's where I source some of my news stories yes, but it's not a news outlet. How would you know a story came from Drudge or if I was on the Washington Examiner site? You wouldn't because it's a Washington Examiner story, not Drudge. Drudge doesn't make or report news it only links to stories already published.

ABC/CBS/Rueters/AP are outlets that report news. Drudge simply links to some of those news outlets among others. Keep thinking you are right if it makes you feel better.

I know exactly what Drudge is because I check it out from time to time. I also realize Drudge has an angle. It's all good. We are all made up of different influences.

[Acid Trip]

I know exactly what Drudge is because I check it out from time to time. I also realize Drudge has an angle. It's all good. We are all made up of different influences.

Every person, website, blogger, salesman, etc has an angle. It's the angle that makes things unique and draws readers/buyers/followers. To think one website has any less of an angle than another is silly.

[Muddy]

Drudge is a special entity though... he typically bundles his own brand of what he see's is important.. Im not sure if there is a left wing equivalent out there..

[JoeyB]

Is saying that someone watches Fox News like the ultimate insult for you to pass out? Your complete obsession with Fox is a little strange.

I don't get my news from Fox or any other TV station if I can help it. I can read news faster than any stupid reporter can speak. My posts come from the Washington Examiner, the Wall Street Journal, Reuters, AP, etc. Where do you get all your "facts" again?

My point is, as long as you post 'facts' that are just heavily biased corporate approved sound bytes, I will never take them seriously. How could I?

It would be as if I entered the argument and posted this:

"Monkeys fly butt, monkeys fly butt! Monkeys...butt...fly. Monkeys fly butt"

And expected you to not only take it seriously, but to waste your time with a response to it.

Everything you post is pre-stamped with the thumb of approval from big business and I won't dignify it with a response because it is propaganda. It doesn't matter if you really do watch Fox or not, you post like a fox anchor speaks. Monkey fly butt!

[Acid Trip]

My point is, as long as you post 'facts' that are just heavily biased corporate approved sound bytes, I will never take them seriously. How could I?

It would be as if I entered the argument and posted this:

"Monkeys fly butt, monkeys fly butt! Monkeys...butt...fly. Monkeys fly butt"

And expected you to not only take it seriously, but to waste your time with a response to it.

Everything you post is pre-stamped with the thumb of approval from big business and I won't dignify it with a response because it is propaganda. It doesn't matter if you really do watch Fox or not, you post like a fox anchor speaks. Monkey fly butt!

Name calling (like always using the term Tea Baggers in reference to the Tea Party) is a cognitive bias and a technique to promote propaganda. If anyone here is a propagandist it's you.

Propagandists (like you) use the name-calling technique to incite fears with the intent that invoked fear (based on fearmongering tactics) will construct a negative opinion about a person, group, or set of beliefs or ideas that the propagandist would wish the recipients to believe.

I use the terms Democrats or Liberals when I refer to the Democrat party. I disagree with them but I don't resort to childish name calling like you do. It's called maturity and you'll get there someday.

[JoeyB]

Name calling (like always using the term Tea Baggers in reference to the Tea Party) is a cognitive bias and a technique to promote propaganda. If anyone here is a propagandist it's you.

Propagandists (like you) use the name-calling technique to incite fears with the intent that invoked fear (based on fearmongering tactics) will construct a negative opinion about a person, group, or set of beliefs or ideas that the propagandist would wish the recipients to believe.

I use the terms Democrats or Liberals when I refer to the Democrat party. I disagree with them but I don't resort to childish name calling like you do. It's called maturity and you'll get there someday.

I freely admit my open dislike of the ridiculous tea party and have on many occasions. At least I am honest about my views.

Also...everything you post is heavily biased. Hiding behind claims of being 'fair and balanced' don't make it so.

And you live in blatant hypocrisy when you says thing such as "It's called maturity and you'll get there someday."

I'm not a fear monger, I always try and fight fear mongers. Fear mongering is the bread and butter of Fox news and the Bush era, who used fear mongering to trick Americans into fighting wars, living with hate, and looking around every corner for the next boogey-man.

I say no to that garbage. I am a name caller to those who earn it, because when you act out of disrespect, I will not dignify you with respect.

But I am not a fear monger. When that Norwegian guy carried out his terrorist plans, and people responded with fear, hate, and quick assumptions, what did I show? Go find that thread and then call me a fear monger. To accuse me of something like that when I have simply said that the tea party are tea baggers is absolutely ridiculous. I mock them because they need mocking. It's not fear, it's humor. Fear mongering? You represent those people.

Also...tea baggers.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Drudge is a special entity though... he typically bundles his own brand of what he see's is important.. Im not sure if there is a left wing equivalent out there..

Never been to the Daily Kos website I see

[Muddy]

Never been to the Daily Kos website I see


I never even heard of it.. Whats the URL?

nevermind, I found it.. Doesnt look anything like Drudge.. Just a big blog..

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Name calling (like always using the term Tea Baggers in reference to the Tea Party) is a cognitive bias and a technique to promote propaganda.

:+1:

Anyone who refers to the Tea Party as Tea Baggers has already lost the argument. And that's exactly the same reason I ignore FBD's posts where he refers to the president as "Obummer".

[JoeyB]

:+1:

Anyone who refers to the Tea Party as Tea Baggers has already lost the argument. And that's exactly the same reason I ignore FBD's posts where he refers to the president as "Obummer".

Tea baggers.

[FBD]

Joey, here's the problem. While many of my posts center around real world concepts, actions of the players and rulemakers thereof, also addressing root causes and downstream results of rule, action and incentive with respect to taxes, regulation, social legislation, implicit open ended government guarantees of taxpayer's money, cronyism, and the government making rules based on favored constituencies over others - yours are but a collection of as-stated namecalling and nonsensical half-attempts at analogy.

You cannot begin to substantively back up your political beliefs based on the downstream results of the collective detriment you call a political philosophy.

:hand:

Regardless of where this news or that news comes from, certain stimuli produce certain outcomes in our quasi-free market. Can you at least demonstrate concepts that can justify what you're arguing? All I missed from assessing your argument was your always criticizing the source of the news, rather than the news itself.

Shoot the messenger, there's a problem with this signal? :-k

[JoeyB]

All I missed from assessing your argument was your always criticizing the source of the news, rather than the news itself.

No...as I have pointed out, your news is highly biased (regardless of where you get it). You often post information that seems corporate approved. How biased is it?...to the point as to be useless to the argument and not worthy of dignifying.

I could post information that shows that Hitler was a great guy and loved the Jews...if I found the right biased sources.

Wouldn't make it so.

And your constant insults and derogatory attitude towards me have yet to prove your supposed superior maturity. I can't recall if that was you or FBD who posted that, or even remember if you are FBD or Acid...as I said before, you guys are the same. I like to think of you as FB Acid. Someday, I will feed you to Jez.

I do enjoy how you (the FB Acid entity) seem riled up by my existence. Oh, I must challenge your beliefs, or else why would you have singled me out a couple of months ago and started sniping at me? And why do you persist now? Sad really.

I now ignore you, as you bore me.

But never tire of waving the corporate banner! You do well serving your overlords. Sieg Heil!**

**=Brought to you by the committee to promote Hitler. Seriously, he was a great guy! Monkey Fly Butt!

Hey...it's a bitch posting when you are half asleep! But fuck grammar, am I right?

Oh and, believe it or not I don't have any actual hostility towards you, my favorite forum entity, I just was so perplexed at your inexplicable singling out of me way back when, and the way you persisted on sniping at me even though I basically never even took note of you until then, that I had to toy back a bit. You'll read this and see weird shit and strange colors, because I imagine you are constantly foaming at the mouth and a little deraged, but I really don't have any antipathy towards you. But, it's like a gnat flying around your face, it does it enough and now and then you wave your hand at it. That's all. Stop buzzing me and we can part ways. I have even agreed with your position on a few things now and again though I doubt you ever noticed.

But seriously, I'm groggy, so, reread this article and then join the Martha Stewart twitter feed. Magic will happen! Or not, you get what you put out in the world...you put out hate, you get hate, you put out penis, you get penis. I'm gonna put out big tits and see what happens...

[FBD]

:-s I dont dislike you bro - even thought I detest the political philosophy you subscribe to, there is a difference - I've got friends who are liberals and we get along fine. All I did was point out some catastrophically significant flaws in your argument, to which you...just dont believe in the reality of them. ;)

[Godfather]

Guess who bought BAC stock at $5.25 a share :lol: Buffet better be on to something


Now go pay your fees peons :demon:

[JoeyB]

:-s I dont dislike you bro - even thought I detest the political philosophy you subscribe to, there is a difference - I've got friends who are liberals and we get along fine. All I did was point out some catastrophically significant flaws in your argument, to which you...just dont believe in the reality of them. ;)

You don't even know what I am...you just think that you do. And all I ever did was point out the blatant nonsense that formed the backbone of your pro-corporate propaganda and white washed garbage. You just refuse to acknowledge that you do the work of Satan.

See, I can do the 'always slam your opponents ideology because that makes your point sound like the only real one' dance too.

I can also do your other fox news approved tactic of repeating a lie until people believe it:

Watch!

Hitler is a swell guy!
Hitler is a swell guy!
Hitler is a swell guy!
Hitler is a swell guy!

It'll catch on eventually.

Oh, and:

Jez has a massive penis!
Jez has a massive penis!

Let's all repeat that one until he's swimming in chubby assed ladies. Who's with me on this?

[DemonGeminiX]

Stop.

[JoeyB]

Jez has a massive penis!

[FBD]

:lol: there's a difference between supporting laws & regulations that are business friendly and specifically being "pro-corporate" - Obama has shown himself to be quite pro-corporate, if your corporation has the right ideology.

it appears that you cant tell the difference.

queue inanity for reply :dance:

[JoeyB]

:lol: there's a difference between supporting laws & regulations that are business friendly and specifically being "pro-corporate" - Obama has shown himself to be quite pro-corporate, if your corporation has the right ideology.

it appears that you cant tell the difference.

queue inanity for reply :dance:

What makes you think I support Obama? Have my numerous comments saying 'I do not like Obama' not set in yet?

I never voted for him nor would I.

And the difference, that's easy...people who use the phrase 'business friendly' are usually pro-corporate tools. Business friendly is a fox approved sort of catchphrase...like how the Bushies called it the 'Patriot Act' when all it did was strip away the liberties that true patriots left us.

I like to think of you people not as hypocrites, but as 'Ideologically Fluid'.

Oh shit...Ideologically Fluid Bear...he doesn't hold to moral standards or need any pesky Ethical rules.

I swear, that was pure accident...fucking awesome! I did an Iffy without even trying. Where is that dude anyway?

[KevinD]

Sneaks in...So Joey, FBD, et all, what do y'all think of my political positions? Am I a war monger, rabid anti liberal, bleeding heart liberal, neo conservative, what?

I,like anyone else have been guilty or reading, hearing, or seeing "news" and flying off the handle without doing any background research. (sh)it happens dude. I get my "news" from various places, but I will admit to only posting things that I am interested in here. To that extent, I will admit to posting anti Obama mostly.

[JoeyB]

Sneaks in...So Joey, FBD, et all, what do y'all think of my political positions? Am I a war monger, rabid anti liberal, bleeding heart liberal, neo conservative, what?

I,like anyone else have been guilty or reading, hearing, or seeing "news" and flying off the handle without doing any background research. (sh)it happens dude. I get my "news" from various places, but I will admit to only posting things that I am interested in here. To that extent, I will admit to posting anti Obama mostly.

You've expressed interest in the tea party, and post some conservative things. Beyond that I haven't a fucking Blues Clues. But if you'd like I'll assign you a political role:

Kevin, you are: Whig Party~!!

Seriously...that would rock if we had a Whig about...it would rock more if you'd consider wearing one of those white powdered wigs too...(not that whig or wig is connected...it's just a historical element that I would find cool on a completely shallow level).

If not that, then how about pro Klingon ambassador to the forum?

Think about it.

Or do both! I'm not sure how a Klingon, with that imposing overgrown forehead, would look in a white powdered wig, but let's say we find out.

[KevinD]

Ahem, I do in fact have a white powdered wig....It's left over from a Halloween costume.
TBH, I don't know that I fall into any of the recognized political groups. I have many things I feel strongly about (the amendments are a few) but, there are things I am liberal about, and things I am conservative about. I don't now, nor have I ever voted any party line. I try to make informed decisions on the candidates and issues, other than that, I leave it blank.

[KevinD]

I do dislike the whole division of the people that is going on now. I wish we could all agree on things more, but I'm realistic to understand that's not going to happen. I particularly dislike rhetoric from any side.

[JoeyB]

I don't now, nor have I ever voted any party line.

I understand, I actually started my own political party, the RCS. So far, me.