Republicans pass debt crisis on to middle class so they can toss another log on the fire this Christmas.

[Muddy]

Fromm cnn Breaking news:

Senate Republicans have blocked a Democratic measure to extend the payroll tax cut and assess a new tax on income over $1 million to help pay for it.
Sixty votes were needed for passage. The vote was 50-48.
A separate Republican bill to extend the payroll tax cut calls for freezing federal pay as well as reducing the federal workforce by 10%, provisions rejected by Obama and Democrats.
The lower payroll tax rate is set to expire at the end of the year.

[PorkChopSandwiches]

why would the freeze federal pay or reduce the work force if they dont have money? No reason for that when there are plenty of shlubs to put the debt on.....................Viva La Revolución


http://rlv.zcache.com/george_washington_viva_la_revolucion_sticker-p217874126771076124z85xz_400.jpg

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Yeah, nice misleading thread title there ;)

[JoeyB]

Listen, it's not a joke, the republican party has one mission above all others: cut taxes for the rich who bankroll them. Nothing else matters as long as they do that, even though they do have other agendas as well.

[Loser]

Yeah, nice misleading thread title there ;)

No shit eh?

This is just more fear mongering bullshit by the dems before election year. No more, no less.


Listen, it's not a joke, the republican party has one mission above all others: cut taxes for the rich who bankroll them. Nothing else matters as long as they do that, even though they do have other agendas as well.

This has nothing to do with cutting taxes, the republicans blocked MORE taxes on people that pay the majority of the taxes as is.

[Muddy]

Whats misleading about it? They just raised taxes for the middle class and presented themselves from paying any further taxes. Forget what they countered with... This is what they did... End of story... Taxes are going up for YOU Lance...

[Loser]

Whats misleading about it? They just raised taxes for the middle class and presented themselves from paying any further taxes. Forget what they countered with... This is what they did... End of story... Taxes are going up for YOU Lance...


They didn't raise shit, they allowed the regular tax level to RETURN TO NORMAL. If the government wanted this to be a permanent measure, they should of done so originally.

On top of that, they wanted to pay for the extension of these tax cuts, on the backs of the people that already pay the MAJORITY of taxes as is.

[Muddy]

They didn't raise shit, they allowed the regular tax level to RETURN TO NORMAL. If the government wanted this to be a permanent measure, they should of done so originally.

On top of that, they wanted to pay for the extension of these tax cuts, on the backs of the people that already pay the MAJORITY of taxes as is.


The majority of taxes arent on their backs... Thats a bunch of shit dude.... The Majority of taxes are paid by the middle class...

[Southern Belle]

Like Porky says, time for a Revolution. I'm sick and tired of carrying their asses, paying for their health insurance when I can't afford any, paying for their luxurious vacations and lifestyles. Fuckers. All of them.

[Loser]

The majority of taxes arent on their backs... Thats a bunch of shit dude.... The Majority of taxes are paid by the middle class...

http://i.imgur.com/py9sn.png

[Loser]

Like Porky says, time for a Revolution. I'm sick and tired of carrying their asses, paying for their health insurance when I can't afford any, paying for their luxurious vacations and lifestyles. Fuckers. All of them.

Agreed.

Tired of watching motherfuckers pay for 500$ in groceries with food stamps and pack all that shit into their brand new SUV.

[Muddy]

http://i.imgur.com/py9sn.png



Save the charts for Deep.... How much did you pay in taxes last year?

[Loser]

Save the charts for Deep.... How much did you pay in taxes last year?

What I paid is irrelevant. The chart is 100% correct and debunks everything that OWP and the Democrats have tried to vehemently cram down peoples throats as a cheap way to get votes.

[PorkChopSandwiches]

I'm in the top 1%................................of bullshit

[Muddy]

What I paid is irrelevant. The chart is 100% correct and debunks everything that OWP and the Democrats have tried to vehemently cram down peoples throats as a cheap way to get votes.

Do you have a chart for this year? Or is 2005 the only one?

[Loser]

Do you have a chart for this year? Or is 2005 the only one?

I'm sure there are more, but I can't be asked to find them. The only difference from then and now is what obama has done. Bush tax cuts were 2003 and are reflected on that chart.

[Muddy]

So did you pay any taxes last year?

[Loser]

So did you pay any taxes last year?

More then I should have...

[Loser]

Here, I'll steal this from lance...

http://i.imgur.com/kyK4s.jpg

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Whats misleading about it? They just raised taxes for the middle class and presented themselves from paying any further taxes. Forget what they countered with... This is what they did... End of story... Taxes are going up for YOU Lance...


They didn't raise shit, they allowed the regular tax level to RETURN TO NORMAL. If the government wanted this to be a permanent measure, they should of done so originally.

On top of that, they wanted to pay for the extension of these tax cuts, on the backs of the people that already pay the MAJORITY of taxes as is.

:agreed:

[RBP]

They didn't raise shit, they allowed the regular tax level to RETURN TO NORMAL. If the government wanted this to be a permanent measure, they should of done so originally.

On top of that, they wanted to pay for the extension of these tax cuts, on the backs of the people that already pay the MAJORITY of taxes as is.

I disagree with you that allowing the tax cuts to expire is not a tax hike. Of course it is. Taxes are one level now and they would go up.

Both parties agree that the tax cuts should be extended, it is just the other stuff that goes along with it that they disagree on.

[RBP]

So did you pay any taxes last year?

For 2010, I paid no federal income taxes. So what? Somehow you equate taxes paid with political positions? There are rich liberals and poor conservatives.

[PorkChopSandwiches]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8bdeizHM9OU

[Loser]

I disagree with you that allowing the tax cuts to expire is not a tax hike. Of course it is. Taxes are one level now and they would go up.

Both parties agree that the tax cuts should be extended, it is just the other stuff that goes along with it that they disagree on.

The only thing they disagree on, as with everything the Dems are trying to push, is a new tax on millionaires.

[Muddy]

:agreed:

You can shake hands all you want.. Your taxes are still going up, while our wealthy counterparts are not... Yay for the Republicans! :lol:

[RBP]

You can shake hands all you want.. Your taxes are still going up, while our wealthy counterparts are not... Yay for the Republicans! :lol:

Wait, what? I think your confused. If the Bush tax cuts are not extended everyone's taxes go up.

[Loser]

Wait, what? I think your confused. If the Bush tax cuts are not extended everyone's taxes go up.

This isn't about the bush tax cuts.

This is about some bullshit obama pulled like 2 years ago to cut 2% from what people pay into social security. He wants to extend these buy raising the taxes on millionaires by 2%.

So basically, more spread the wealth socialist bullshit.

[RBP]

This isn't about the bush tax cuts.

This is about some bullshit obama pulled like 2 years ago to cut 2% from what people pay into social security. He wants to extend these buy raising the taxes on millionaires by 2%.

So basically, more spread the wealth socialist bullshit.

Maybe if we had a better OP. :lol:

I guess I am the confused one, I looked for more because the OP is non-descript.

[Muddy]

Wait, what? I think your confused. If the Bush tax cuts are not extended everyone's taxes go up.


This cuts the payroll tax cuts... I dont think it affects the rich... I may be confused though.... I am under the impression there were 2 cuts Bush put on the table...

[Teh One Who Knocks]

You can shake hands all you want.. Your taxes are still going up, while our wealthy counterparts are not... Yay for the Republicans! :lol:

Must be nice to live in your little world where you only read the part of the story that makes your argument sound valid :)

[Muddy]

Maybe if we had a better OP. :lol:

I guess I am the confused one, I looked for more because the OP is non-descript.


Agreed... it is just a "CNN breaking news" blurb I get in my email..

[Teh One Who Knocks]

This isn't about the bush tax cuts.

This is about some bullshit obama pulled like 2 years ago to cut 2% from what people pay into social security. He wants to extend these buy raising the taxes on millionaires by 2%.

So basically, more spread the wealth socialist bullshit.

Exactly...and the republicans wanted to pay for it by freezing government wages and cutting the government workforce, but ohhhhhhhhh no, we can't do something like that :roll:

[Muddy]

Must be nice to live in your little world where you only read the part of the story that makes your argument sound valid :)

Must be nice to live in your little word where you enjoy keeping the master fat and happy.. :)

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Must be nice to live in your little word where you enjoy keeping the master fat and happy.. :)

Whatever you say Mr Sheeple :thumbsup:

[Muddy]

Whatever you say Mr Sheeple :thumbsup:

Get out of here with your Ol Android.. :razz:

[Muddy]

Heres the Fox take..

----------------------------------

WASHINGTON – House Republicans are on a collision course with the White House and potentially the Senate over an emerging proposal to extend the payroll tax cut, teeing up a protracted debate that could keep lawmakers in Washington for the holidays as they try to avert a Jan. 1 tax increase.

The Senate on Thursday afternoon rejected rival Democratic and GOP plans for extending the cut. The failure was expected, cueing the House to step in with a new plan.

Details of that proposal, expected to be unveiled in full on Friday, suggest its Republican authors are preparing for a showdown with President Obama. The bill includes a controversial provision to move along the construction of an oil pipeline from Canada to Texas -- the Obama administration recently put that project on hold until after the 2012 election, citing environmental and safety concerns.

The provision pertaining to the Keystone pipeline helped sweeten the deal for House conservatives skeptical of a payroll tax extension.

Rep. Lee Terry, R-Neb., told Fox News that a number of Republicans who were on the fence said they would vote for the bill if it includes the Keystone pipeline provision.

House Speaker John Boehner said Thursday he's confident Republicans are ready to move on the proposal.

But Obama explicitly has said he will reject any effort to tie the Keystone pipeline construction to the tax extension. His allies echoed that message Friday.

"It's a non-starter," House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi said.

Her top deputy, Rep. Steny Hoyer, D-Md., urged Republicans to "reconsider" the Keystone language.

White House Press Secretary Jay Carney warned Republicans not to include "extraneous attachments" in the bill.

"Whatever happened to Republicans being for tax cuts?" Carney asked. "Is it because this one goes to 160 million Americans, middle-class working Americans, that they're ambivalent or they're willing to oppose it if they don't get some political scalp? Is it because President Obama supports it, or Democrats support it?"

At stake is a cut in the Social Security tax valued at about $1,000 a year for the average family.

The rate was lowered from 6.2 percent to 4.2 percent for 2011, but that expires at the end of the year without action by Congress. Obama has called for extending the cut, and increasing it by another percentage point. He also wants Congress to extend unemployment insurance.

But while Congress appeared to be heading once again toward gridlock, the House could be in a position to try to corner the Senate.

House leaders could be poised to hold a vote on the bill, as early as next week, and then send their members home for the holidays -- in turn forcing the Senate to decide between their bill and no bill. This would then force a confrontation between the Senate and the White House.

Terry said he thinks there's a "high" likelihood the House will try to stick the Senate with their version of the bill.

"Frankly, the fact that the president doesn't like it makes me like it even more," said Ohio Rep. Jim Jordan, a leader of House conservatives, who added he had supported an earlier version, as well.

According to sources, the House bill's price tag clocks in at between $175 billion and $180 billion.

At its core, the emerging House bill would extend the existing Social Security payroll tax cut at the heart of Obama's jobs program, through 2012. It also would renew an expiring benefit program for the long-term unemployed the president also favors, although at a reduced level from current law.

In addition, Republicans are proposing to avert a 27 percent cut in payments to doctors serving Medicare patients, a provision that Democrats have said privately they are receptive to.

The emerging House bill also is expected to block implementation of a proposed Environmental Protection Agency regulation limiting toxic emissions from industrial incinerators, another potential area for dispute with the White House.

While there is general agreement among leaders of both parties that the legislation must be paid for to avoid raising deficits, there are differences over the details.

Democrats favor imposing a surtax on incomes over $1 million, hoping to depict Republicans -- nearly all of whom are opposed -- as protecting millionaires at the expense of the middle class.

House Republicans want to raise premium fees on the wealthy for Part B Medicare, a change that they note would fall on many of the same people the Democrats want to tax.

The House bill also would freeze pay for two additional years for federal retirees and increase their retirement costs.

Also in the measure is the repeal of nearly $43 billion already approved for the year-old health care law, which stands as Obama's signature domestic achievement.

There was no suspense in the Senate on Thursday, where blocking maneuvers left rival payroll tax plans short of the 60 votes needed to advance for the second consecutive week.

The vote on the Democrats' plan was 50-48, with Sen. Susan Collins of Maine the only Republican in favor. It would lower next year's payroll tax to 3.1 percent, financed mainly by the millionaire surtax.

The Republican measure was turned aside 22-76. A majority of Republicans opposed it, reflecting the party's internal divisions. That measure would leave next year's payroll tax at 4.2 percent, paid for largely by freezing salaries and cutting the size of the federal workforce.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/12/08/senate-rejects-democrats-revised-payroll-tax-cut-bill/#ixzz1fzZVOuXH

[Loser]

This cuts the payroll tax cuts... I dont think it affects the rich... I may be confused though.... I am under the impression there were 2 cuts Bush put on the table...


There's only one tax cut, and it's 2% to social security. It was across the board, all classes.

So basically, the Democrats*socialists* want to extend those cuts to the middle and lower class, and make the top 1%, who already pay the majority in taxes, pay for them.

[Loser]

Democrats favor imposing a surtax on incomes over $1 million, hoping to depict Republicans -- nearly all of whom are opposed -- as protecting millionaires at the expense of the middle class.

And this is why it's failing. Because democrats are attempting to play their political bullshit to gain votes.

[FBD]

:lol: and Obama has the utter gall to get up and say republicans want to trash SS - what is the funding mechanism for SS? Payroll taxes. So when he did that temporary useless bullshit, he was taking money that funds SS and simply expecting the difference to be made up somewherethereabouts else.

Math does not exist in his world.

Then again, they go straight to Corzine for economic advice.

Which we're finding out means "rip everyone the fuck off."

[Muddy]

And this is why it's failing. Because democrats are attempting to play their political bullshit to gain votes.

Lets keep in mind that little blurb is from a Fox News article.

[Muddy]

For 2010, I paid no federal income taxes. So what? Somehow you equate taxes paid with political positions? There are rich liberals and poor conservatives.

The reason I kept asking people "How much did you pay in taxes" yesterday was just trying to make the point... 'Does this personally affect you?'.. This subject personally hits MY wallet... That's the only thing I was digging at... Were people that were making comments about the subject affected by this in any way? It's easy to weigh in on a subject when you don't have a pony in the race.. Not trying to offend anyone...

[Acid Trip]

The reason I kept asking people "How much did you pay in taxes" yesterday was just trying to make the point... 'Does this personally affect you?'.. This subject personally hits MY wallet... That's the only thing I was digging at... Were people that were making comments about the subject affected by this in any way? It's easy to weigh in on a subject when you don't have a pony in the race.. Not trying to offend anyone...

I paid more in taxes last year than anyone here. Does that make my opinion more valuable than yours or anyone else? I know you would love for the wealthy to pay all taxes because you made it quite clear you only care about YOUR wallet. As long as it's not YOUR money you're all for it. Fuck fairness or equal tax burden because it's all about you, you, you. Class warfare has claimed another victim.

Now that we have that out of the way, let me do a little explaining about what is ACTUALLY happening because it's obvious some people here don't have a clue.

The 2% payroll tax cut was for everyone. When it expires guess what? It goes back up for everyone.

What is the payroll tax used for? It funds Social Security. As a result of the 2% payroll tax cut we blew a $112 billion dollar hole in the SS budget this year.

Why would Democrats who never want to cut Social Security cut the tax that funds Social Security? Don't they know the program is heading towards insolvency? Any attempt at cutting SS in the past has been met with "You're trying to kill Grandma and she's owed that money!" and yet they did it by reducing the tax that funds it. Quite the contradiction wouldn't you say?

And why are Democrats in such a tizzy about the Keystone Pipeline being part of the tax cut negotiations? It would create tens of thousands of temporary construction jobs, several thousand permanent jobs, and help the US reject Middle Eastern Oil and instead accept it from our good friends up North.

Doesn't that sound like everything we've wanted to do for the last 10 years with all this energy independence talk? The US clearly doesn't have the oil it needs so why not turn to a best friend instead of a bunch of countries that hate our guts? Environmental concerns my ass. There is a massive pipeline in Alaska and it does just fine under far more severe weather conditions.

[RBP]

The reason I kept asking people "How much did you pay in taxes" yesterday was just trying to make the point... 'Does this personally affect you?'.. This subject personally hits MY wallet... That's the only thing I was digging at... Were people that were making comments about the subject affected by this in any way? It's easy to weigh in on a subject when you don't have a pony in the race.. Not trying to offend anyone...

I am not offended, I just think that's a bullshit position to take.

[PorkChopSandwiches]

I think everyone should work for free and the government hands out housing and food for the effort

[Arkady Renko]

For 2010, I paid no federal income taxes. So what? Somehow you equate taxes paid with political positions? There are rich liberals and poor conservatives.

no representation without taxation

[Muddy]

I am not offended, I just think that's a bullshit position to take.

I was also curious at the people that were saying something about 'sick of seeing someone sticking $500 worth of food stamp purchased groceries in an Suv and being offended by it..' So I was also saying.. If you didn't pay any taxes why are you offended? I was curious why Loser was so offended... Was it his money the gov. was giving away?

[RBP]

I was also curious at the people that were saying something about 'sick of seeing someone sticking $500 worth of food stamp purchased groceries in an Suv and being offended by it..' So I was also saying.. If you didn't pay any taxes why are you offended? I was curious why Loser was so offended... Was it his money the gov. was giving away?

What's your beef? I used to pay oodles of taxes and now I don't... again, so what. That means I can't have an opinion on what is best for my country?

[PorkChopSandwiches]

Ron Paul

[Muddy]

My beef is that I think we're being railroaded by the Republicans and there is so much spin out there that people don't even see it...

[PorkChopSandwiches]

Dont get it twisted, we are being railroaded by our government on a whole.

[RBP]

My beef is that I think we're being railroaded by the Republicans and there is so much spin out there that people don't even see it...

So your response is to attack other posters as not being worthy of having an opinion?

[Muddy]

So your response is to attack other posters as not being worthy of having an opinion?

I think to describe my interaction as an "attack" is a little strong. I merely made the suggestion that because some of you don't personally have a pony in this race, and it doesn't personally affect you.. That may make it easier to make an ideological stand.

[RBP]

I think to describe my interaction as an "attack" is a little strong. I merely made the suggestion that because some of you don't personally have a pony in this race, and it doesn't personally affect you.. That may make it easier to make an ideological stand.

It is an attack meaning to discredit other posters. My pony in this race is the future of my country and what impact decisions made in Washington have. Why don't you argue the issue instead of making it personal.

[Muddy]

Because it is personal.. :lol:

[Loser]

My beef is that I think we're being railroaded by the Republicans and there is so much spin out there that people don't even see it...

Wrong.


Dont get it twisted, we are being railroaded by our government on a whole.

WINNER WINNER! :lol:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I'm single and I have no house, I am the single most screwed demographic when it comes to Federal Income Tax because I get ZERO deductions other than my personal exemption. Last year I paid just under $10K in Federal tax alone (I know because I just looked it up), so I hope that's enough to make my opinion valid.

This country does not have a revenue problem, it has a spending problem. As has been already mentioned, the payroll tax cut affects money going into the SS trust fund. Keep extending it without paying for it, and it keeps making a bigger hole in that trust fund. The democrats big idea is to create more taxes to pay for this particular cut by putting yet an even bigger burden on the people already paying the majority of taxes in this country. The republicans want to extend it by reducing spending by the amount the cut creates (roughly $112 billion).

There is only one side to be on in this debate. You either let the cuts expire and go to back to the original rate or if you want to extend them for another year, then cut Federal spending somewhere, not by increasing the tax rate on an entire group of people, whether you think they can 'afford it' or that they 'owe us' or not. But instead the democrats are trying to turn this whole thing into an election year football by playing the 'class warfare' card with it. And I notice the democrats don't make a big deal of the fact that Harry Reid said this is the only extension this cut will get. For 2013 the rate will return to where it was regardless.

Go ahead people, keep on siding with the side that wants to tax the well off folks into oblivion. But just remember all that when these rich people, the ones that own companies and supply jobs, decide that they've had enough and they close down the company you work for and move it out of the country (or close it down completely) and you end up unemployed while they have all their money offshore, that at least hey, you got what you were 'owed' while you could.

[PorkChopSandwiches]

http://www.ccwbystate.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/ron-paul-budget-plan-2012.png

[Muddy]

I read your opinion Lance, thanks for the share.. I don't work for a big company so I'm not really affected by the different ways those crooks avoid taxes. I'm going to bow out now.. I dont want to push this thing to the point of people hating me for my honest opinion.


http://www.ccwbystate.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/ron-paul-budget-plan-2012.png

It doesnt matter if he cant get it passed Porky... :lol:

[PorkChopSandwiches]

he can just do what Obama does and override everyone.