Romney's Income, taxes, and Charitable giving... what say you.

[RBP]

In the two years total (2010 and 2011 (est)) the Romney's made ~$42.5 million.

They donated ~$7 million.

They paid ~$6.2 million in Federal taxes.

I am looking for numbers, NOT the same tired arguments from other threads.

So tell me what is a "fair" amount to give to charity and pay in federal taxes on $42.5M over a 2 year period.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I have absolutely no problem with the amount of taxes he paid and the amount he donated to charity.

[Hal-9000]

If the figures are accurate, he donated 1/6th of his income to charity.At that level of course he'll get concessions, still a nice gesture on paper.He paid 1/7th of his earnings for tax.Again, nice chunk on paper if his earnings were recorded accurately.

This is for a two year period? To compare, I didn't donate 1/6th of my income to charity in the past two years.I got taxed fairly heavily for what little I made tho :lol:

[Godfather]

Maybe wealthy people would pay a reasonable and proportioned amount of taxes if the laws weren't so convoluted and stupid. The Tax Code is a fuggin' bible.... five million words or something?

If you make shitty tax laws that take professionals to translate, is it a surprise some people find loopholes? Obviously the wealthy are going to hire lobbyists & lawyers to go to work for them in Washington and make a game of it.

Spending 5 billion hours of America's time on this is a joke. Streamline and simplify tax laws and everything will be dandy. It would put a shit load of lawyers, lobbyists and accountants out of work though :lol:

[Hal-9000]

I agree.Using accountants with IQ's of 160 to massage numbers to the point where the rich person in question can't even be audited because no one can follow the white rabbit, is unfair :lol:

[Godfather]

Look at that, 2 Canadians talking US tax law. They'll love that :lol: *run*






(In seriousness, the same shit applies up here too)

[Hal-9000]

Was searching for this quote immediately below and came across another quote by Einstein :lol:

“If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough”



"The hardest thing in the world to understand is income tax."

[RBP]

Neither of you cannuckleheads answered the question. What is the correct tax and donation level for $42.5M over two years?

Per Obama's SOTU address tonight, Romney should have paid a minimum tax of $12.75M.

[Muddy]

I paid almost 20% in taxes when all was said and done..(deductions for mortg. interest paid etc.) I think.. I can find out exactly if my math is fuzzy.. My accountant is a Republican and he said always budget 30% for estimated taxes when you prepay quarterly like we do. So that being said, His tax rate is low compared to what the middle class paid. Whatever he chooses to give to charity is on him as long as he does it post tax.. Give it all away to charity, I could care less..

My accountant also said... Dont be sad if you pay a million dollars in taxes.. It probably means you made 3 million dollars..

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I checked mine yesterday, I won't say exactly how much I made last year, but it was more than $50K and less than $75K and I am single with no deductions other than my personal exemption and my deduction for my IRA contributions. My effective tax rate was just over 13.1% last year.

[DemonGeminiX]

In the two years total (2010 and 2011 (est)) the Romney's made ~$42.5 million.

They donated ~$7 million.

They paid ~$6.2 million in Federal taxes.

I am looking for numbers, NOT the same tired arguments from other threads.

So tell me what is a "fair" amount to give to charity and pay in federal taxes on $42.5M over a 2 year period.

:-s

It depends. What does current federal law say is fair?

[PorkChopSandwiches]

So tell me what is a "fair" amount to give to charity and pay in federal taxes on $42.5M over a 2 year period.

to give to charity? None - All, its not a requirement

[MrsM]

:-s

It depends. What does current federal law say is fair?

Just based on income...

over $388,350 you would pay $105,062 + 35% of the excess over $388,350

But then there are huge amounts of things you can do to reduce your taxes.

[DemonGeminiX]

Just based on income...

over $388,350 you would pay $105,062 + 35% of the excess over $388,350

But then there are huge amounts of things you can do to reduce your taxes.

:-k

That's according to our law? Or Canadian law? Or are they the same?

[MrsM]

That is US Code Section 1(a) - from the Rev Proc 2011-52

[RBP]

Just based on income...

over $388,350 you would pay $105,062 + 35% of the excess over $388,350

But then there are huge amounts of things you can do to reduce your taxes.

But that's income not cap gains. right?

[Hal-9000]

Neither of you cannuckleheads answered the question. What is the correct tax and donation level for $42.5M over two years?

Per Obama's SOTU address tonight, Romney should have paid a minimum tax of $12.75M.

Can't recall seeing the question phrased in that fashion :hand:

could you be a little more vague, it would help.........

[MrsM]

I assumed that he filed as married

TABLE 1 — Section 1(a) — Married Individuals Filing Joint Returns and Surviving Spouses
If Taxable Income Is: The Tax Is:
Not over $17,400 10% of the taxable income
Over $17,400 but not over $70,700 $1,740 plus 15% of the excess over $17,400
Over $70,700 but not over $142,700 $9,735 plus 25% of the excess over $70,700
Over $142,700 but not over $217,450 $27,735 plus 28% of the excess over $142,700
Over $217,450 but not over $388,350 $48,665 plus 33% of the excess over $217,450
Over $388,350 $105,062 plus 35% of the excess over $388,350

[Hal-9000]

I checked mine yesterday, I won't say exactly how much I made last year, but it was more than $50K and less than $75K and I am single with no deductions other than my personal exemption and my deduction for my IRA contributions. My effective tax rate was just over 13.1% last year.

whoa, you make twice as much as me


:sad2:



*collects bottles and places gently in the cart*

[Hal-9000]

I assumed that he filed as married

TABLE 1 — Section 1(a) — Married Individuals Filing Joint Returns and Surviving Spouses
If Taxable Income Is: The Tax Is:
Not over $17,400 10% of the taxable income
Over $17,400 but not over $70,700 $1,740 plus 15% of the excess over $17,400
Over $70,700 but not over $142,700 $9,735 plus 25% of the excess over $70,700
Over $142,700 but not over $217,450 $27,735 plus 28% of the excess over $142,700
Over $217,450 but not over $388,350 $48,665 plus 33% of the excess over $217,450
Over $388,350 $105,062 plus 35% of the excess over $388,350


:shock:

it's the tax whisperer

[MrsM]

But that's income not cap gains. right?

Right - just Income

There are some funky things with Capital Gains and passive activities

[MrsM]

There is a reason that good accountants can bill $300+/hr

[RBP]

So MrsM... forget the law. what is a fair amount for the Romney's to have paid?

[Teh One Who Knocks]

whoa, you make twice as much as me


:sad2:



*collects bottles and places gently in the cart*

Sorry :oops:

[MrsM]

So MrsM... forget the law. what is a fair amount for the Romney's to have paid?

The numbers that you posted seems fair based on his income and what he paid/donated (31%). I'm sure the difference between the 31 and 35% were based on some creative accounting for investments and gifts.

I think what people get caught up on is the tax $ and disregards the donations - from my POV I'm ok with what he has paid.

[Muddy]

I just dont get how you can factor a donation in to say his numbers are acceptable.. Now If it was a donation to the feds I could see.. But not to some stupid church... Thats retarded... It's like saying I gave Porky $15,000 last year... It doesnt matter...

[Hal-9000]

Yeah but dude....gov is not usually classified as a charity :lol:

charities are a voluntary donation, where it lands is not really for us criticize, right?

[PorkChopSandwiches]

I just dont get how you can factor a donation in to say his numbers are acceptable.. Now If it was a donation to the feds I could see.. But not to some stupid church... Thats retarded... It's like saying I gave Porky $15,000 last year... It doesnt matter...

*starts a non-profit*

[Muddy]

Yeah but dude....gov is not usually classified as a charity :lol:

charities are a voluntary donation, where it lands is not really for us criticize, right?

Sure I can criticize when people lump it in with what he paid in taxes... They are 2 totally separate different things... :lol:

[Hal-9000]

*starts a non-profit*

Porky's Roadside BJ's & Handjobs :thumbsup:

[Hal-9000]

Sure I can criticize when people lump it in with what he paid in taxes... They are 2 totally separate different things... :lol:

I get that but you're slagging him for making a donation...it is legal and part of the tax process in terms of write offs isn't it?

So it's ok if he paid 10 million to the gov in taxes but not ok if he donated 5 million to Unicef?

[Hal-9000]

sidebar,

so what does this 'Mitt' person do to make 42 million in 2 years anyways?

[Hal-9000]

tell me...what kind of name is 'Mitt' anyway? Is is short for baseball mitt or something?

[Muddy]

I get that but you're slagging him for making a donation...it is legal and part of the tax process in terms of write offs isn't it?

So it's ok if he paid 10 million to the gov in taxes but not ok if he donated 5 million to Unicef?

I've already said earlier I could care less what he donates... It's his money.. But what he chooses to donate to shouldn't be taken into consideration when talking about what he pays in federal taxes..


tell me...what kind of name is 'Mitt' anyway? Is is short for baseball mitt or something?

He buys companies and re-sells them or strips them apart.. Like the asshole in the movie 'pretty woman'.. :lol:

I think it's known as a 'venture capitalist'..

[Hal-9000]

okely dokey

[MrsM]

I just dont get how you can factor a donation in to say his numbers are acceptable.. Now If it was a donation to the feds I could see.. But not to some stupid church... Thats retarded... It's like saying I gave Porky $15,000 last year... It doesnt matter...

I think it's important to give a tax break for donations because it gets more money to causes than what the gov may give. I agree that there are some charities that I would like to get less money (donations to political parties are an example). I don't know all the rules for donations, but my understanding is that it's pretty open.

I understand where you are coming from - and I'm sure that there are people out there that take advantage of the donations. But if done right more money gets to the charity then if it went through the government and they determined how to distribute it

[Muddy]

tell me...what kind of name is 'Mitt' anyway? Is is short for baseball mitt or something?

Really the guys got an interesting story if you are interested..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitt_Romney

[Muddy]

I think it's important to give a tax break for donations because it gets more money to causes than what the gov may give. I agree that there are some charities that I would like to get less money (donations to political parties are an example). I don't know all the rules for donations, but my understanding is that it's pretty open.

I understand where you are coming from - and I'm sure that there are people out there that take advantage of the donations. But if done right more money gets to the charity then if it went through the government and they determined how to distribute it


It's funny... We have some of the biggest non profit churches in Virginia in my area... Bringing in 15-20 million a year in "donations"... Yet they still have the gall to call and threaten the local grocery stores to provide fee drinks and whatever else they need at their church functions... Bunch of fuggin crooks.. I hear you though...

[Teh One Who Knocks]

He buys companies and re-sells them or strips them apart.. Like the asshole in the movie 'pretty woman'.. :lol:

I think it's known as a 'venture capitalist'..

:rolleyes:

[Hal-9000]

It's funny... We have some of the biggest non profit churches in Virginia in my area... Bringing in 15-20 million a year in "donations"... Yet they still have the gall to call and threaten the local grocery stores to provide fee drinks and whatever else they need at their church functions... Bunch of fuggin crooks.. I hear you though...

The confederate bible belt of hell :lol:

[Hal-9000]

Really the guys got an interesting story if you are interested..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitt_Romney

thank you sir...I'll wait until your elections are done and see who shakes out....then I'll be interested (somewhat) :lol:

[Muddy]

:rolleyes:

Maybe it's like that show "shark tank" or whatever it was..? I dunno. sue me.

[Muddy]

The confederate bible belt of hell :lol:

Organized religion is organized crime...

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Maybe it's like that show "shark tank" or whatever it was..? I dunno. sue me.

No no, keep on spouting stuff you would hear on MSNBC or the Obama campaign, it's amusing :thumbsup:

[MrsM]

It's funny... We have some of the biggest non profit churches in Virginia in my area... Bringing in 15-20 million a year in "donations"... Yet they still have the gall to call and threaten the local grocery stores to provide fee drinks and whatever else they need at their church functions... Bunch of fuggin crooks.. I hear you though...

If it was up to me I would want to see changes to where you can donate to - or what %break you get based on the charity - however I know that this will never happen. everyone has their own list of what they want to support.

[Hal-9000]

Organized religion is organized crime...

my church is somewhat organized :lol: ...and they don't ask for donations (will accept them tho) :thumbsup:

[Hal-9000]

No no, keep on spouting stuff you would hear on MSNBC or the Obama campaign, it's amusing :thumbsup:

You're bringing politics into a thread like this???!!!!! :x





oh...






:coat:

[Muddy]

No no, keep on spouting stuff you would hear on MSNBC or the Obama campaign, it's amusing :thumbsup:

I'm glad you are amused.. :) It is like the show 'shark tank' though.. They are venture capitalists..


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mrScvCZd6UI

http://abc.go.com/shows/shark-tank/about-the-show

Richard Gere was a 'corporate raider' in the 'pretty woman' movie..

[PorkChopSandwiches]

http://www.lazypalace.com/img01/drunk-photos02.jpg

[Hal-9000]

double fisting Marg's...ohhh yeah baby

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I have no problem with people donating to religious/faith based charities. Who is it to decide what's a worthy charity or not? As long as they follow the laws set up for charitable organizations, then let people put their money where they want. It sure is a hell of a lot better than giving it to the Feds and letting them piss it away on bullshit.

I'm not religious at all, but one charity I donate to multiple times a year is the Denver Rescue Mission, a religious charity, because they do more here for the local homeless than the government ever could.

[DemonGeminiX]

I'm naked. :shifty:

[PorkChopSandwiches]

http://i.imgur.com/xpYqQ.jpg

[MrsM]

I'm naked. :shifty:

I am too










(under my clothes):dance:

[DemonGeminiX]

*Jiggles* :twisted:

[DemonGeminiX]

I wonder how much worse the tax code would be if polygamy was legal.

:-k

[Muddy]

It sure is a hell of a lot better than giving it to the Feds and letting them piss it away on bullshit.



Like the deficit? :lol:

[Hal-9000]

I have no problem with people donating to religious/faith based charities. Who is it to decide what's a worthy charity or not? As long as they follow the laws set up for charitable organizations, then let people put their money where they want. It sure is a hell of a lot better than giving it to the Feds and letting them piss it away on bullshit.

I'm not religious at all, but one charity I donate to multiple times a year is the Denver Rescue Mission, a religious charity, because they do more here for the local homeless than the government ever could.

I think you'll find most religious based charities are affiliated with 'helping' organizations, even if the organization is the church itself.

It's only knobs like Swaggart and Graham and Baker that soil the waters to the tune of millions....

[PorkChopSandwiches]

I think you'll find most religious based charities are affiliated with 'helping' organizations, even if the organization is the church itself.

It's only knobs like Swaggart and Graham and Baker that soil the waters to the tune of millions....

I disagree, I think most of them are just greedy. I know there are plenty that help, but we have "chain" churches over here. There is only one reason to run a "chain"

[Hal-9000]

I disagree, I think most of them are just greedy. I know there are plenty that help, but we have "chain" churches over here. There is only one reason to run a "chain"

I would disagree (x2) Up here, in my world anyway...churches don't ask for money to line the pockets of the pastors or the ministers.At most they use the funds for upkeep of the location and to provide services for the congregation.

My church does a lot of missionary work in Africa and now Japan, funds are used for relief over there and rebuilding.

Guys like Graham saying - I need 12 million bucks or God will call me home....that's just utter horseshit.I could have used a bullet and got him home a lot cheaper....

[Muddy]

My uncle has a nasty little church that borders his property.. They always threaten him because he wont sell them some land... Well last week they got caught opening a 'helping house' down in Richmond and they were sposed to be taking the profits from the bingo and donating them to this 'helping house'... Well someone uncovered that they had done over 2 million in Bingo takings and had only donated the 'helping house' something stupid like $20,000 dollars... Bunch of fuggin crooks.. Imma go over there and piss on their church... I may beat someones fucking face in if they speak ill to my uncle again..

[PorkChopSandwiches]

It may be just what I have seen when I did attend church and what I see when I look around where I live. Look at all the locations of this church (http://calvarychapel.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=5&Itemid=69) in particular. Church should be a local/community thing, not a chain where all the money trickles up.....like the vatican

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Like the deficit? :lol:

Yeah, because they are putting so much money towards the deficit....increasing it that is

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I think you'll find most religious based charities are affiliated with 'helping' organizations, even if the organization is the church itself.

It's only knobs like Swaggart and Graham and Baker that soil the waters to the tune of millions....

I agree...I would never donate to any charity run by a televangelist

[Hal-9000]

Bono from U2 (whether you like him or not is moot) sang a great little saying...The Lord I believe in isn't shorta cash mister

[Teh One Who Knocks]

The sad thing is, so many people believe all that horse shit and send their money to those fuckwads, especially the elderly :|

[Hal-9000]

It's one of those - take a minute and explore what the money is actually doing.

I wouldn't donate to any form of charity where 90% of my donation goes to the CEO's pockets....you gotta follow the cash


in other news, did you know that I was invited to Indonesia after their Tsunami in 2004? To (hold your breath now) build a school and dwellings as part of some missionary work...Unfortunately funding restricted access for over 10 people from our group and I couldn't afford to pay for the airfare myself :oops:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

One of our customers belongs to a church (don't know the denomination, never asked and he's never said) and after the Haitian earthquake, he went down to help build new houses and dig new drinking water wells for the people down there. He ended up getting cholera from the contaminated water down there and almost died. :wha:

He's a super nice guy and just another example why people shouldn't dismiss people of faith.

[Hal-9000]

That's pretty much it up here Lance.If you donate to a church, the money is used for the church or to help others.I've met guys who have quit jobs just to spend a year in Africa and live way below the poverty level while working over there.We (or I) don't see too much misappropriation of funds when it comes to religious groups.

Strangely enough, when I donate to charities it's rarely church funded organizations, I give to mainstream charities that help kids and abused women.

[Muddy]

Yeah, because they are putting so much money towards the deficit....increasing it that is

We should all take a lesson from Wesley Snipes....