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View Full Version : Lawyer: Lesbians’ assault on gay man can’t be hate crime



Teh One Who Knocks
02-26-2012, 12:54 PM
By Richard Weir - The Boston Herald


http://i.imgur.com/z4iwo.jpghttp://i.imgur.com/aBg3k.jpghttp://i.imgur.com/EoTyX.jpg

Three women identified by their lawyers as lesbians were arraigned yesterday on a hate crime charge for allegedly beating a gay man at the Forest Hills T station in an unusual case that experts say exposes the law’s flawed logic.

“My guess is that no sane jury would convict them under those circumstances, but what this really demonstrates is the idiocy of the hate-crime legislation,” said civil liberties lawyer Harvey Silverglate. “If you beat someone up, you’re guilty of assault and battery of a human being. Period. The idea of trying to break down human beings into categories is doomed to failure.”

Prosecutors and the ACLU of Massachusetts said no matter the defendants’ sexual orientation, they can still face the crime of assault and battery with intent to intimidate, which carries up to a 10-year prison sentence, by using hateful language.

“Someone who is Jewish can be anti-Semitic,” said ACLU staff attorney Sarah Wunsch. “The mere fact that someone is a member of the same class doesn’t mean they could not be motivated by hatred for their very own group.”

But Carolyn Euell, 38, mother of two of the defendants, Erika Stroud, 21, of Dorchester and Felicia Stroud, 18, West Roxbury, told reporters the alleged attack “can’t be hateful” because both her daughters are lesbians.

Prosecutor Lindsey Weinstein said the two sisters and one of their domestic partners, Lydia Sanford, also a defendant, viciously beat the man Sunday, repeatedly punching and kicking him after he bumped them with his backpack on a stairwell.

She said the victim, who suffered a broken nose, told cops he believed the attack was “motivated as a crime because of his sexual orientation” since the three women “called him insulting homophobic slurs.”

But attorney Helene Tomlinson, who represented Sanford, told the judge her client is “openly identified as a lesbian ... so any homophobic (conduct) is unwarranted.” She said the alleged victim was the aggressor and used racial slurs: “He provoked them.”

Felicia Stroud’s attorney, C. Harold Krasnow, said, “They don’t know what his sexual orientation is, just like he doesn’t know what theirs is.”

Krasnow later noted the low bail the judge gave the women, $100 to $500 cash, and suggested the prosecution’s case was weak.

Civil-rights attorney Chester Darling agreed. “No one should go to court. It’s knuckle justice,” he said. “It’s a fair exchange.”

But Jake Wark, a spokesman for Suffolk District Attorney Daniel F. Conley, said prosecutors will have no problem proving the women committed a hate crime, even if they are lesbians.

“The defendants’ particular orientation or alleged orientations have no bearing on our ability to prosecute for allegedly targeting a person who they believe to be different from them,” he said.

deebakes
02-26-2012, 03:08 PM
one of these things is not like the other :-k

RBP
02-26-2012, 03:55 PM
I am not a fan of hate crime statutes, but saying you can't commit a hate crime because you are the same protected class is stupidity.

deebakes
02-26-2012, 06:23 PM
lesbians and gay dudes are not in the same class :hand:

Hal-9000
02-27-2012, 07:55 PM
Isn't that Theo Huxtable in the first pic? :face:

Godfather
02-27-2012, 07:59 PM
Does the fact that the accused is an open homosexual not call into question the claims of the victim that this crime was motivated by his being gay?

I'm not saying they're not guilty of assault or whatever, but you have to admit it's at least plausible that the victim simply threw in the Gay-card to drive his case home.

But on a grander scale, I totally agree with RBP. Saying a homosexual isn't capable of a hate crime is bogus.

PorkChopSandwiches
02-27-2012, 08:01 PM
“If you beat someone up, you’re guilty of assault and battery of a human being. Period. The idea of trying to break down human beings into categories is doomed to failure.”

ding ding ding ding

Hal-9000
02-27-2012, 08:03 PM
It's the 'why' behind assaults that muddies the waters....


hate crime is the reasoning behind some attacks without any other sort of provocation so I think it's valid...


eg The guy got beat because he was gay, he didn't steal someone's money or mouth off to his attackers

PorkChopSandwiches
02-27-2012, 08:13 PM
Why is that any different then me getting beat up? Why if I was gay and they want to label it a hate crime is it deserving of a harsher punishment then the same beat down on a straight person. Its the same shit, whatever the motivation, it all needs to be treated the same.

Godfather
02-27-2012, 08:17 PM
I'd tend to agree with that. Though there are experts who say it needs to be different

http://articles.cnn.com/2009-06-29/justice/levin.hate.law_1_gender-identity-hate-identity-and-disability?_s=PM:CRIME

PorkChopSandwiches
02-27-2012, 08:19 PM
I say fuck the experts. :hatecrime:

Joebob034
02-27-2012, 08:21 PM
:gay:

Hal-9000
02-27-2012, 09:36 PM
Why is that any different then me getting beat up? Why if I was gay and they want to label it a hate crime is it deserving of a harsher punishment then the same beat down on a straight person. Its the same shit, whatever the motivation, it all needs to be treated the same.

On the broader scope, you're right.A person getting assaulted is just that...someone getting hurt at the hands of another.

But the reasoning behind the assault is what the court looks at.If the person is getting beat based solely on their sexual orientation, that needs to be examined and brought to light. eg NOT A GOOD REASON

If the person is getting beat because they owe 3000 dollars for a meth debt, it's a different motivation behind the physical act.





Now shut up, get over here and give me some head you meth addict :x Let's see if we can knock down that bill of yours a bit :thumbsup: