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View Full Version : Texas execution: How much is a death worth?



redred
03-07-2012, 09:27 PM
The cost of lethal injection drugs used in the US to kill criminals on death row has risen dramatically over the past year. The increase comes as their manufacturers move to prevent them being used in executions.

The state of Texas is scheduled to spend $1,286.86 (£811) to kill Keith Thurmond on Wednesday night.

Thurmond, a 52-year-old former air-conditioning technician, was convicted in 2002 of killing his estranged wife and her lover in an argument over child custody.

A little after 18:00 local time (midnight GMT), Texas prison officials will strap Thurmond to a gurney and inject a series of three drugs into his arm.

The cost of the death drugs has risen 15-fold since 2010, when they cost the state $86 (£55).

That is because the drug formerly used to sedate the patient, thiopental sodium, is no longer available, having been pulled off the market in 2010.

As a result, Texas and several other states switched to another sedative, pentobarbital. The drug is significantly more expensive - and it may soon become impossible for capital punishment prisons to purchase.

"Even though it is a small amount in the big scheme of things, it represents one more spiralling expense that makes the death penalty less reliable and more costly," says Richard Dieter, executive director of the Death Penalty Information Center in Washington DC.

"From a cost-benefit analysis, the scales tip away from keeping capital punishment."

Volumes of research have suggested the death penalty is significantly more expensive to taxpayers than the punishment of life in prison, due largely to the lengthy legal processes involved.

Fundamentally, it stems from the use of what opponents say is a barbaric, antiquated mode of punishment within a sophisticated legal system ostensibly aimed at ensuring the rights of the accused, preventing punishment of the innocent, and executing human beings without causing them too much physical pain and suffering.

Aside from Texas, most of the 34 US states with death penalty laws on the books seldom carry out executions. But even those that do must spend billions of dollars to defend the death sentence against prisoners' appeals and to house the condemned securely and what they see as humanely.

California, for instance, has spent about $4bn (£2.54bn) since 1978 to fund its capital punishment system, but has executed only 13 prisoners, Federal Judge Arthur Alarcon and Loyola Law School Professor Paula Mitchell found in a law review article.

In that same period, at least 78 death row inmates died of natural causes, suicide or other causes while awaiting execution, they wrote.

In Washington state, one prosecutor told a committee of the state bar association that capital cases are at least four times as costly to prosecute as a non-capital murder trial.

"The rarefied nature of a death penalty case results in more motions being brought and more advocacy being presented, which further adds to the time and costs of a capital case," the commission reported in 2006.

The on-the-day costs of the execution vary from state to state, but are relatively small compared to the costs the states incur on the way to the death chamber.

The state of Washington spent $97,814 (£62,004) to execute Cal Brown in 2010.

Most of that was staff pay, but the state also had to hire fencing and lighting for the demonstration outside the prison, a tent for news media, food for the special security teams, and counselling for staff, says Maria Peterson, a spokeswoman for the Washington department of corrections.

Also, the thiopental sodium used to sedate the convicted murderer cost $861.60 (£546), she says.

Ronnie Lee Gardner's 2010 execution by firing squad cost Utah $165,000 (£105,000). Most of that was staff pay, but $25,000 (£15,800) went on materials used in the execution, including the chair to which he was strapped and the jumpsuit he wore, a corrections spokesman told the Salt Lake Tribune.

The execution of rapist and murderer Robert Coe in 2000 cost Tennessee $11,668 (£7,395), according to a report by the state comptroller. That included medical supplies and personnel and the death drugs.

The cost of the death drugs in Texas, Ohio, Oklahoma and other states has risen as manufacturers pull the drugs off the market, not wanting to supply pharmaceutical products used to end lives.

Texas and other states switched the sedative used to render the condemned person unconscious from thiopental sodium to pentobarbital last year after the only US maker of the drug, Hospira, said it was pulling the drug off the market in order to avoid a row with authorities in Italy, where the drug was manufactured.

In December, the European Commission ordered EU firms wanting to export drugs that can be used in lethal injections to ensure the product was not going to be used for executions.

Indian producer Kayem Pharmaceuticals has also said it will no longer sell thiopental sodium to US prisons.

It is unclear how long pentobarbital, the current replacement drug, will be available.

The only company approved by US drug regulators to market the sedative in the US, Danish pharmaceutical giant Lundbeck, has just sold the drug to Illinois company Akorn, which has pledged to restrict distribution of it to prevent it being sent to prisons in capital punishment states.

Now, purchasers must sign a form affirming they will use the drug, normally used to treat epilepsy and other conditions, on their own patients and not resell it without authorisation.

The difficulty obtaining the death drugs illustrates the problems inherent in lethal injection as an execution method, says Kent Scheiddeger, legal director of the Criminal Justice Legal Foundation, which supports the death penalty.

"It amounts to medicalising a procedure that shouldn't have anything to do with medicine," he says.

"It's supposed to be punishment - it shouldn't be this quasi-medical procedure. It just strikes me as wrong and now we have all these additional complications. Manufacturers, particularly in Europe, try to meddle in things that are none of their business and try to cut off the supply."

Mr Scheidegger does not foresee a halt to executions forced by a lack of drugs, as the executioners can merely change the ingredients in the cocktail, he says.

"Any barbiturate will do it," he says.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17210285

found this a good read and thought i'd share

PorkChopSandwiches
03-07-2012, 09:29 PM
still cheaper then housing and feeding these fucks ;)

redred
03-07-2012, 09:31 PM
i agree

PorkChopSandwiches
03-07-2012, 09:33 PM
California, for instance, has spent about $4bn (£2.54bn) since 1978 to fund its capital punishment system, but has executed only 13 prisoners, Federal Judge Arthur Alarcon and Loyola Law School Professor Paula Mitchell found in a law review article.

How the fuck do they come up with this figure? (4bn)

PorkChopSandwiches
03-07-2012, 09:35 PM
WTF, are we retarded?
http://articles.latimes.com/2011/jun/20/local/la-me-adv-death-penalty-costs-20110620

Loser
03-07-2012, 09:36 PM
One simple reason.

Because they keep giving stays to these bastards, then they have to pay to house/feed/cloth/medicate/etc.., that all got figured into their death row system, which is separate from their normal prison system.

They are just using this as a way to try and stop capital punishment.

Notice how that federal asshat didn't mention why it cost 4bn? Exactly.

PorkChopSandwiches
03-07-2012, 09:38 PM
My link kinda breaks it down. Turns out CA is mostly retarded

Loser
03-07-2012, 09:49 PM
Don't worry, Cali isn't alone, New York is right up there with them ;)

Hal-9000
03-07-2012, 09:57 PM
still cheaper then housing and feeding these fucks ;)

and didn't JoeyB tell us that it costs more to kill a prisoner that feed and clothe and baby him for life?

I recall Minz was in that thread too...

Hal-9000
03-07-2012, 09:58 PM
1200 = lethal injection
1200 = Xbox and Xbox Live membership for a year for the prisoner


...

Richard Cranium
03-07-2012, 10:11 PM
$.22 for a bullet after you make the fucker dig a grave.. fuck'em..

Teh One Who Knocks
03-07-2012, 10:16 PM
and didn't JoeyB tell us that it costs more to kill a prisoner that feed and clothe and baby him for life?

That's a lie perpetrated by the bleeding heart anti-death penalty people. The reason it costs more is because of the reasons Loser brought up. Too many hurdles to get someone executed, even if they are stone cold guilty without even the slightest bit of doubt.

minz
03-07-2012, 10:25 PM
That's a lie perpetrated by the bleeding heart anti-death penalty people. The reason it costs more is because of the reasons Loser brought up. Too many hurdles to get someone executed, even if they are stone cold guilty without even the slightest bit of doubt.

Exactly the point, they are entitled to legal representation for all manner of appeals etc and that's what bumps up the cost, it's cheaper to keep them incarcerated for life than to resort to state sponsored murder, which is basically all it is.

Teh One Who Knocks
03-07-2012, 10:27 PM
Exactly the point, they are entitled to legal representation for all manner of appeals etc and that's what bumps up the cost, it's cheaper to keep them incarcerated for life than to resort to state sponsored murder, which is basically all it is.

I'm sorry, but there are people on this planet that have committed crimes so horrific that they have forfeited their life and they no longer belong on this planet. It's cheaper to execute them swiftly than to house and feed them for 30, 40, 50, or 60 years.

Hal-9000
03-07-2012, 10:30 PM
I didn't take a DVD back on time once



:oops:

minz
03-07-2012, 10:30 PM
I didn't take a DVD back on time once



:oops:

Off with your head then young man!

Hal-9000
03-07-2012, 10:35 PM
It was kinda funny...I always took my VHS tapes and DVD's back on time for years.I missed taking one back and called the store.Got a bitch of a manager and asked her how much my charge was.She wouldn't tell me....her reasoning was - If we tell people then they won't come in and pay the late fee.(mine was probably 3 days late at most)

So I said fine, you won't tell me and I won't be back anytime soon :lol: Last time I rented anything and the store was ROGERS you assholes!!!! :x


:dance:

minz
03-07-2012, 10:39 PM
It was kinda funny...I always took my VHS tapes and DVD's back on time for years.I missed taking one back and called the store.Got a bitch of a manager and asked her how much my charge was.She wouldn't tell me....her reasoning was - If we tell people then they won't come in and pay the late fee.(mine was probably 3 days late at most)

So I said fine, you won't tell me and I won't be back anytime soon :lol: Last time I rented anything and the store was ROGERS you assholes!!!! :x


:dance:

I rarely watch films so I doubt I'll have that problem :lol:

Hal-9000
03-07-2012, 11:01 PM
I rarely rent films but watch quite a few...so I don't have that problem anymore :lol:

Acid Trip
03-08-2012, 03:25 PM
Texas. Kill someone in our state and we'll kill you right back.

Teh One Who Knocks
03-08-2012, 03:40 PM
Here is how capital punishment would work in the country of Lancistan:

If you are trial for a capital crime and you are found 'not guilty', that will be the end of everything. However, if you are found guilty, the case goes to an automatic appeal with a new judge and new jury so that the people involved aren't tainted by the details of the first trial. The defendant can use the same lawyer or he can choose a new lawyer. If after the 2nd trial you are found 'not guilty, again, it ends there. However, if a 2nd jury finds you guilty, then you will be immediately sentenced with the execution to happen in no less than 1 year and no more than 2 years. During the time the person is in jail awaiting execution, if he thinks he can prove his innocence (assuming at this point that there is even a shred of a chance that he is actually innocent), he can try and dig up evidence to prove it. But, to be able to take the case back to appeals, it would have to be significant evidence that would prove innocence, not all the crap they use to get cases to appeals now.

In this day and age with how good forensics are now, if you go through two complete trials and are still found guilty, I'm gonna say that you are most likely guilty.

This would give the defendant ample chance to prove innocence and it would cost a lot less than the string of endless appeals we have in this country now.

PorkChopSandwiches
03-08-2012, 04:16 PM
I would like that to apply to child rapists as well :tup:

Godfather
03-08-2012, 04:24 PM
Money aside, my feelings are pretty mixed. There's no place on this earth for serial killers and anyone who hurts children. But this sums up the problem I have with the death penalty.

http://i40.tinypic.com/jpf190.jpg

PorkChopSandwiches
03-08-2012, 04:30 PM
I dont see your point. 3 people who were convicted got acquitted, so its a failed system?

Godfather
03-08-2012, 04:35 PM
I dont see your point. 3 people who were convicted got acquitted, so its a failed system?

It's just an illustration of 'how society sees the justice system', x=whatever number of people. The point is that we look at it as a system where most who are guilty are convicted, and most who are innocent go free. We see a few who are guilty go free (think Casie Anothony). And there's no consideration as a whole, for those who are innocent and convicted (or in some cases put to death).

I'm not arguing for or against any one system and morally I'm for the death penalty... I think Lance's system sounds best, but even he said this:




In this day and age with how good forensics are now, if you go through two complete trials and are still found guilty, I'm gonna say that you are most likely guilty.


I totally agree... most likely. But I'm not sure that's good enough when youre putting people to death. It's a practical problem I have with the death penalty in any system.

PorkChopSandwiches
03-08-2012, 04:39 PM
Im all for less people :tup:

I also have a hard time thinking people who may have been wrongfully accused are guilty free. So maybe that would just be bonus deaths.

Godfather
03-08-2012, 04:44 PM
:lol:

Teh One Who Knocks
03-08-2012, 04:52 PM
Im all for less people :tup:

I also have a hard time thinking people who may have been wrongfully accused are guilty free. So maybe that would just be bonus deaths.

Exactly...if there is enough evidence to put you at the crime scene, even if you aren't the one that pulled the trigger, then IMO you are as guilty as the guy that did pull the trigger. No big loss to society.

Teh One Who Knocks
03-08-2012, 04:53 PM
I totally agree... most likely. But I'm not sure that's good enough when youre putting people to death. It's a practical problem I have with the death penalty in any system.

I have no problem with it at all ;)

Hal-9000
03-08-2012, 05:49 PM
Here is how capital punishment would work in the country of Lancistan:

If you are trial for a capital crime and you are found 'not guilty', that will be the end of everything. However, if you are found guilty, the case goes to an automatic appeal with a new judge and new jury so that the people involved aren't tainted by the details of the first trial. The defendant can use the same lawyer or he can choose a new lawyer. If after the 2nd trial you are found 'not guilty, again, it ends there. However, if a 2nd jury finds you guilty, then you will be immediately sentenced with the execution to happen in no less than 1 year and no more than 2 years. During the time the person is in jail awaiting execution, if he thinks he can prove his innocence (assuming at this point that there is even a shred of a chance that he is actually innocent), he can try and dig up evidence to prove it. But, to be able to take the case back to appeals, it would have to be significant evidence that would prove innocence, not all the crap they use to get cases to appeals now.

In this day and age with how good forensics are now, if you go through two complete trials and are still found guilty, I'm gonna say that you are most likely guilty.

This would give the defendant ample chance to prove innocence and it would cost a lot less than the string of endless appeals we have in this country now.


In Halistan it works like this:

If more people say that you're guilty than people who say you're innocent, you are put to death that night.


:thumbsup:

Acid Trip
03-08-2012, 06:08 PM
In Halistan it works like this:

If more people say that you're guilty than people who say you're innocent, you are put to death that night.


:thumbsup:

Death by Democracy. Sounds like a movie just waiting to happen Hal.

Teh One Who Knocks
03-08-2012, 06:15 PM
In Halistan it works like this:

If more people say that you're guilty than people who say you're innocent, you are put to death that night.


:thumbsup:

Sounds like North Korea :hand:

Teh One Who Knocks
03-08-2012, 06:21 PM
The other thing about execution in Lancistan:

No more sanitizing it, I would bring back the gas chamber, the electric chair, and the gallows. It pisses me off to no end that these vile people that commit heinous crimes get off easy with the method of execution now (lethal injection). That's bullshit because they sure as hell weren't thinking of the pain and suffering of the victim when they murdered them.

DemonGeminiX
03-08-2012, 06:24 PM
The other thing about execution in Lancistan:

No more sanitizing it, I would bring back the gas chamber, the electric chair, and the gallows. It pisses me off to no end that these vile people that commit heinous crimes get off easy with the method of execution now (lethal injection). That's bullshit because they sure as hell weren't thinking of the pain and suffering of the victim when they murdered them.

:hand:

Save the tax payers some money and use a bullet.

Hal-9000
03-08-2012, 06:36 PM
The other thing about execution in Lancistan:

No more sanitizing it, I would bring back the gas chamber, the electric chair, and the gallows. It pisses me off to no end that these vile people that commit heinous crimes get off easy with the method of execution now (lethal injection). That's bullshit because they sure as hell weren't thinking of the pain and suffering of the victim when they murdered them.


My execution chamber is set up right next door to the Anger Management seminars.There's a connecting door and tools....

Halistan = economic efficiency

Teh One Who Knocks
03-08-2012, 07:05 PM
:hand:

Save the tax payers some money and use a bullet.

1 rope is a lot cheaper than having to use a bullet every time :nono:

Hal-9000
03-08-2012, 07:18 PM
just have a room that's airtight...close the door and wait.


:lol:

DemonGeminiX
03-08-2012, 10:07 PM
1 rope is a lot cheaper than having to use a bullet every time :nono:

:hand:

A bullet is a sure thing. You might mess up with the rope.

minz
03-08-2012, 10:50 PM
:huh:




:meh: