Will intergalactic travel ever be possible?

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I know we haven't even conquered interplanetary travel yet (or interstellar travel for that matter), but I think within the next 50 years (sooner hopefully) we should be able to put a man on Mars and jump the first hurdle of interplanetary travel. Then I think within the next 100 to 150 years science should advance far enough to make interplanetary travel possible, without even really needing to break the speed of light, or even come close to breaking the speed of light for that matter (which as of now is still theoretically impossible anyways).

But, intergalactic travel is a whole different animal when you consider the vast distances between galaxies. I believe the closest full sized (not dwarf) galaxy is the Andromeda Galaxy which is around 2.5 million light years away from our galaxy. Forget that light speed travel or FTL (faster than light) travel is impossible for a minute, and just think that even at the speed of light it would take 2.5 million years to reach Andromeda. Can we ever find a means of propulsion that can go fast enough to ever cover that vast amount of distance?

Thoughts? :-k

[DemonGeminiX]

Wait long enough. The Andromeda galaxy is supposedly moving towards ours and they'll eventually collide... in roughly 4 billion years.

If we get over our petty differences before they serve to destroy us and survive as a species, then maybe we'll eventually be able to achieve intergalactic travel. But we'll have to go about mining for the raw materials to do it on other planets because by the time we get that kind of knowledge to apply to the problem of intergalactic travel, our resources on this planet we'll be depleted.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

But do you think there will be some way to travel that kind of distance in a "realistic" amount of time? Even in science fiction where only propulsion is used (no wormholes or whatnot), intergalactic travel was not feasible at all.

Take the episode of Star Trek TOS with the Kelvans from the Andromeda Galaxy...even when they altered the Enterprise to make the warp drive go faster, it was still going to take them several hundred years to get to Andromeda.

(I realize that is science fiction, but at least they were trying to be 'realistic' about it considering most of Star Trek had some basis in science fact)

[Acid Trip]

But do you think there will be some way to travel that kind of distance in a "realistic" amount of time? Even in science fiction where only propulsion is used (no wormholes or whatnot), intergalactic travel was not feasible at all.

Take the episode of Star Trek TOS with the Kelvans from the Andromeda Galaxy...even when they altered the Enterprise to make the warp drive go faster, it was still going to take them several hundred years to get to Andromeda.

(I realize that is science fiction, but at least they were trying to be 'realistic' about it considering most of Star Trek had some basis in science fact)

Cryogenics could make traveling extreme distances possible. Freeze the astronauts for the length of the trip then thaw them out at the end. Millions of years could pass and the astronauts would wake up the same age they went to sleep.

Sure, everyone the astronauts knew would be gone (and possibly the Earth itself) but you would have successfully escaped our galaxy before it collides with another.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

Cryogenics could make traveling extreme distances possible. Freeze the astronauts for the length of the trip then thaw them out at the end. Millions of years could pass and the astronauts would wake up the same age they went to sleep.

Sure, everyone the astronauts knew would be gone (and possibly the Earth itself) but you would have successfully escaped our galaxy before it collides with another.

I've thought about suspended animation/cryogenics of some kind, but what about the super structure of the spaceship? Not to mention the computers on board....how do you build something that will last a million years plus?

[Muddy]

Not without some alien intervention.. :2cents:

[DemonGeminiX]

But do you think there will be some way to travel that kind of distance in a "realistic" amount of time? Even in science fiction where only propulsion is used (no wormholes or whatnot), intergalactic travel was not feasible at all.

Take the episode of Star Trek TOS with the Kelvans from the Andromeda Galaxy...even when they altered the Enterprise to make the warp drive go faster, it was still going to take them several hundred years to get to Andromeda.

(I realize that is science fiction, but at least they were trying to be 'realistic' about it considering most of Star Trek had some basis in science fact)

Keep in mind that most of the technology that we have today was once just some crazy notion from some far out science fiction writer. Today's imagination breeds the technology of the future. And we've never met an obstacle that we weren't able to conquer. People used to say that no one would ever fly, yet we fly. People used to say that the sound barrier would never be broken, yet we broke it. People used to say that we'd never get to outer space. It might take some time, we might have to evolve into something other than what we currently are, but don't count out our ability to achieve. Intergalactic travel's just another boundary for some brilliant mind in the future to break through. And the solutions to the problems of the future may look nothing like what we would expect them to.

[DemonGeminiX]

On December 3, 2012, NASA scientists announced that Voyager 1 had discovered a previously unknown region of the heliosphere. Described as a "magnetic highway," here the pressure of the interstellar medium sweeps back the Sun’s magnetic field and with it many of the slower moving particles emerging from within the solar system. These are mixed with faster moving particles entering the solar system from the interstellar medium. The magnetic field in this newly discovered region is 10 times more intense than Voyager 1 encountered before the termination shock. It is expected to be the last barrier before the spacecraft exits the solar system completely and enters interstellar space.

Voyager 1 is predicted to enter the interstellar medium between 2012–15.

[Acid Trip]

I've thought about suspended animation/cryogenics of some kind, but what about the super structure of the spaceship? Not to mention the computers on board....how do you build something that will last a million years plus?

I could see machines running on a set maintenance schedule (check X, Y, and Z every N years) but anything outside the ship would be tough. Like how do you fix a hole on the outside of the ship if the crew is pretending to be popsicle sticks?

[Hal-9000]

I know we haven't even conquered interplanetary travel yet (or interstellar travel for that matter), but I think within the next 50 years (sooner hopefully) we should be able to put a man on Mars and jump the first hurdle of interplanetary travel. Then I think within the next 100 to 150 years science should advance far enough to make interplanetary travel possible, without even really needing to break the speed of light, or even come close to breaking the speed of light for that matter (which as of now is still theoretically impossible anyways).

But, intergalactic travel is a whole different animal when you consider the vast distances between galaxies. I believe the closest full sized (not dwarf) galaxy is the Andromeda Galaxy which is around 2.5 million light years away from our galaxy. Forget that light speed travel or FTL (faster than light) travel is impossible for a minute, and just think that even at the speed of light it would take 2.5 million years to reach Andromeda. Can we ever find a means of propulsion that can go fast enough to ever cover that vast amount of distance?

Thoughts? :-k


I was under the impression that the closest star was 4.3 light years away...regardless, it's an easy calculation. Distance divided by our fastest speed possible. If you're talking about not having to achieve the speed of light, you can take the miles per hour equivalent of the speed of light, knock a few thousand off of that to achieve a fastest speed possible scenario and then check that against distance needed to get to your destination.

short answer - no :lol:

[Acid Trip]

I was under the impression that the closest star was 4.3 light years away...regardless, it's an easy calculation. Distance divided by our fastest speed possible. If you're talking about not having to achieve the speed of light, you can take the miles per hour equivalent of the speed of light, knock a few thousand off of that to achieve a fastest speed possible scenario and then check that against distance needed to get to your destination.

short answer - no :lol:

He's talking about leaving the Milky Way and traveling to another Galaxy, not traveling to another star in our own galaxy.

[Lambchop]

Wait, you mean Stargate isn't real?

[Hal-9000]

He's talking about leaving the Milky Way and traveling to another Galaxy, not traveling to another star in our own galaxy.

that's what I read too...further awaaaaaay

[Acid Trip]

that's what I read too...further awaaaaaay

I was hoping for a lengthy post about using masturbating trannies as a possible power source. All I got out of your first post was "short answer - no"

I am dissapoint. :(

[Hal-9000]

I'm trying to figure out how another galaxy away from the Milky Way is closer than our closest star? :-k


what am I missing?




and yes I've spent a fair amount of time reading about space travel and trying to visualize those vast distances based on speeds that man can actually attain....that's why the short answer is no :lol:
I'm not a pessimist, it's just the overwhelming fact that even at light speed, these distances are too great taking years to get to the destination.

Either man has to completely rethink his propulsion system (not burning carbon based fuels or even using ion propulsion, which is too slow anyways...) or rethink the idea of not using the straight line method to travel to galactic destinations (which is the topic of another thread)

[Pony]

:-k

I think my parts guy may have been lying to me when he told me a part was on intergalactic backorder.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I'm trying to figure out how another galaxy away from the Milky Way is closer than our closest star? :-k


what am I missing?

:facepalm:

Andromeda is 2.5 million light years away, not 2.5 light years :slap:

[Acid Trip]

Our Sun + planets = solar system

Billions upon billions of stars (ie solar systems) = galaxy

Billions upon billions of galaxies = The Universe

I think you are confusing stars/solar systems with galaxies.

[Hal-9000]

Our Sun + planets = solar system

Billions upon billions of stars (ie solar systems) = galaxy

Billions upon billions of galaxies = The Universe

I think you are confusing stars/solar systems with galaxies.



:slap: No, I read 2.5 light years and am fully aware of space terms

[Hal-9000]

:facepalm:

Andromeda is 2.5 million light years away, not 2.5 light years :slap:

I was at work and misread...


shove it up Uranus :x

[Hal-9000]

so now I change my original answer to

Un-fcking possible, it will never happen :)

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I was at work and misread...


shove it up Uranus :x

http://i.imgur.com/HJYXk.jpg

[Acid Trip]

:slap: No, I read 2.5 light years and am fully aware of space terms

:-k


I was at work and misread...


shove it up Uranus :x

:shock:


so now I change my original answer to

Un-fcking possible, it will never happen :)

:lol:

Now that's the Hal I know.

[Hal-9000]

http://i.imgur.com/mcQAr.jpg

[Hal-9000]

:-k



:shock:



:lol:

Now that's the Hal I know.

he changed his original post, I'm sure of it :lol:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

he changed his original post, I'm sure of it :lol:

I have been known to ninja edit from time to time....however this is not one of those times :hand:

The blame lies squarely on your reading comprehension :nono:

[Acid Trip]

he changed his original post, I'm sure of it :lol:

Gotta keep an eye on those red named peeps. Bunch of sneaky mofos...

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I could see machines running on a set maintenance schedule (check X, Y, and Z every N years) but anything outside the ship would be tough. Like how do you fix a hole on the outside of the ship if the crew is pretending to be popsicle sticks?

Humans can barely build electronics that last 10 years now, how are they going to build systems (guidance, life support, etc) that will last over a million years? :lol:

[Hal-9000]

this is what we should do...

list the speed of light in miles per hour (670 616 629 miles per hour)
list the distance of a light year in miles (6 trillion if I recall correctly)

and then do some realistic number crunching :face:

[Hal-9000]

I have been known to ninja edit from time to time....however this is not one of those times :hand:

The blame lies squarely on your reading comprehension :nono:


I was ninja reading ?


8-[



(looking but not gazing DIRECTLY at...)

[Hal-9000]

damn...5,880,000,000,000 miles = the physical distance of one light year


so Alpha Centuri is 4.3 light years away or 4.3 x 5,880,000,000,000 miles.

[Acid Trip]

Humans can barely build electronics that last 10 years now, how are they going to build systems (guidance, life support, etc) that will last over a million years? :lol:

I'm hoping that if our species survival is on the line the ship will be stamped with "Made in the USA" not "Made in China".

[Teh One Who Knocks]

damn...5,880,000,000,000 miles = the physical distance of one light year


so Alpha Centuri is 4.3 light years away or 4.3 x 5,880,000,000,000 miles.

And with current propulsion systems, how long would it take to get there?

[DemonGeminiX]

I was ninja reading ?


8-[



(looking but not gazing DIRECTLY at...)

Looking but not looking? Glancing? You glanced at it? You didn't read it at all, did you?

[Hal-9000]

Looking but not looking? Glancing? You glanced at it? You didn't read it at all, did you?


8-[


I was reading it surreptitiously over someone else's shoulder while disguised as a park bench

[Hal-9000]

And with current propulsion systems, how long would it take to get there?


:-k


Depends if we take the Chrysler or the Prius rocket I guess...

[Goofy]

And with current propulsion systems, how long would it take to get there?

Depends how fast a car you have and how big the fuel tank is :)


I think one day Scotty will be able to beam us to other planets in milliseconds :tup:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

:-k


Depends if we take the Chrysler or the Prius rocket I guess...

:slap:

Found this:


Interestingly, the fastest spacecraft ever built weren't headed out of the Solar System at all, but in toward the Sun. The Helios probes were West German vehicles launched by NASA, one in 1974, the other in 1976, producing successful missions to study conditions close to the Sun for a period of over ten years. The orbits of these two craft were highly elliptical, and at closest approach to the Sun, each reached speeds in the range of 70 kilometers per second. Helios II, marginally faster, lays claim to being the fastest man-made object in history.

[Acid Trip]

And with current propulsion systems, how long would it take to get there?

70 kilometers per second = 43 miles per second

4.3 light years x 5,880,000,000,000 miles per light year = 25,284,000,000,000 miles

25,284,000,000,000 / 43 miles per second = 588,000,000,000 seconds required

588,000,000,000 / 60 = minutes required / 60 = hours required / 24 = days required...

6,805,555.55 years to travel 4.3 light years @ 43 miles per second

[Hal-9000]

remember the other graphic you posted about space speeds and various crafts Lance?

I had read about the Helios satellite and how it achieved that speed....basically like the old sci-fi slingshot maneuver around a celestial body except the probe was screaming straight down at the sun to reach the 70 kilometers per second :lol:

of course manned crafts have been much slower...Ion propulsion is neat except it starts out too slow and then exponentially gains speed with each day/week/month it's in flight

[Hal-9000]

70 kilometers per second = 43 miles per second

4.3 light years x 5,880,000,000,000 miles per light year = 25,284,000,000,000 miles

25,284,000,000,000 / 43 miles per second = 588,000,000,000 seconds required

588,000,000,000 / 60 = minutes required / 60 = hours required / 24 = days required...

6,805,555.55 years to travel 4.3 light years @ 43 miles per second

there's some good math :thumbsup:

There's also the other thing about even if we could achieve a decent speed (let's say 800 million miles per hour), the human inside the craft would never survive the velocity :lol: Bodies become denser with each G force applied against them and anything over 7 G's gets a wee bit uncomfy for the pilot

[Goofy]

anything over 7 G's gets a wee bit uncomfy for the pilot

Especially when you're drunk :puke:

[Hal-9000]

Especially when you're drunk :puke:

Did you know the Mars probe was essentially a huge thrust off of the Earth and then it literally coasted for 70% of it's mission?

:lol: Hells Bells I wouldn't want to be on a craft that's traveling millions of miles on momentum...

[Goofy]

Did you know the Mars probe was essentially a huge thrust off of the Earth and then it literally coasted for 70% of it's mission?

:lol: Hells Bells I wouldn't want to be on a craft that's traveling millions of miles on momentum...

Just like Apollo 13 using the moon slingshot thingy :tup:

[Hal-9000]

Just like Apollo 13 using the moon slingshot thingy :tup:

That there was such a huge story about ingenuity and creativity...I read that the movie didn't even capture the actual dire straights those dudes were in...

The onboard computer for the entire craft had less processing power than a hand held calculator from the 90's. The fitting of the square peg into the round hole (air filter thingy) literally happened where the ground crew reproduced everything the flight crew had on the LEM, right down to the cups and underwear :lol: and then they started the process of fixing the air system when those guys had something like 3% oxygen left...


space travel scares the crap outta me for those reasons...something goes wrong and there's no handy-dandy computer to execute repairs on C deck after a hole appears :shock:

[Muddy]

The only way possible is to master Quantum Mechanics..

[Hal-9000]

The only way possible is to master Quantum Mechanics..


...... or rethink the idea of not using the straight line method to travel to galactic destinations (which is the topic of another thread)



:thumbsup:

[Muddy]

I think its the basis of an actual working star gate..

[Goofy]

:thumbsup:


I think its the basis of an actual working star gate..



I think one day Scotty will be able to beam us to other planets in milliseconds :tup:

^^ :thumbsup:

[Muddy]

So thats 3 for Quantum mechanics..

[Hal-9000]

it's all moot anyways....by the time man can safely travel to Jupiter for example, our planet will be a dead moon and people will be eating each other during the final days.....





keep a happy thought eh? :lol:

[Goofy]

Now i'm hungry again :|

[Muddy]

That's why we need help from Aliens. We need a huge technological jump..

[Hal-9000]

this is how it will all break down...

First a huge solar flare will shoot out 50 million miles from the sun containing so much radiation that it will create a huge electromagnetic pulse (EMP) and wipe out every device with a computer chip on the planet.

Cars will stop, the economy will fail instantly and even people with cash will roam the streets looking for food and supplies....Lord of the Flies time so only the strongest and most intelligent will survive the initial EMP.


When production on a mass scale stops (and it will) the existing food and water will run out......and then we start eating each other....






Space travel will be like a distant dream and conversations like this will become legend :lol: