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Teh One Who Knocks
04-25-2011, 11:19 PM
Fox News


http://i.imgur.com/wtHMf.jpg

The news was simply too exciting to keep under wraps: A Swiss particle accelerator may have found a long-sought subatomic bit called the Higgs Boson -- something never before seen, but thought to be the fundamental unit of matter. It's called the "God Particle" because it is the one thing that lends mass to all other stuff.

But is it too good to be true? Or merely blabbering physicists, battling it out for a spot in the public eye?

The controversial rumor is based on a leaked internal note from physicists at the Large Hadron Collider (LHC), a 17-mile-long particle accelerator near Geneva that sits on the sharpest part of the cutting edge of science. The note details an unexpected "bump" in emissions that may be proof of the long-sought particle.

If the find is true, it's a game changer for science, explained Dmitri Denisov, a physicist with Fermilabs in Illinois.

"I would compare it to the discovery of electricity," he told FoxNews.com.

Sau Lan Wu, the Enrico Fermi professor of physics at the University of Wisconsin, Madison, and one of the controversial memo's authors, told FoxNews.com she couldn't speak further about the discovery -- not yet, anyway.

But two weeks earlier, scientists at the Tevatron atom smasher at Fermilab in Illinois heralded their own discovery: a new particle, also evidenced by a "bump" in the data.

Sound familiar?

The Tevatron bump and the CERN bump aren't connected, however, said Rob Roser, staff scientist at Fermilab. He pointed out that the two colliders work in different ways, one smashing protons and antiprotons, the other colliding protons with other protons. But Roser was unsurprised that Wu had made such a startling claim.

"She's very aggressive, shall we say," he told FoxNews.com

Roser said Wu's team has been on a lengthy quest for the Higgs Boson, ever since CERN shuttered her old project -- the aging Large Electron Positron Collider II. Just before that project ended, Wu claimed a similar discovery, Roser said.

"She didn't just happen on this, she's been pushing hard on the data sets and pushing to understand the simulations for quite a while," he told FoxNews.com.

Tommaso Dorigo, an experimental particle physicist who works with both atom smashers, blogged about Wu's discovery on Friday. He shared the same suspicions as Roser, noting that Wu was "among those less happy of the decommissioning of LEP II at the time when they were claiming a possible Higgs signal."

"Maybe these guys have been looking for some confirmation of the 115 GeV Higgs all along," he wrote. Dorigo did not respond to FoxNews.com requests for more information.

James Gillies, a spokesman for CERN, explained that the leaked note faces several layers of scrutiny before it could be submitted for publication. "Things such as this show up quite frequently in the course of analysis," he told FoxNews.com.

"It's way too soon to get excited, I'm afraid," he said. "It's not the physics find of the millennium, unfortunately."

WHAT IS A 'HIGGS BOSON'?

Isn't mass just inherent in stuff? How could one particle be responsible for the mass of another? Physicists believe the Higgs does just that -- and an analogy at the Exploratorium website explains the concept nicely.

"Imagine you're at a Hollywood party. The crowd is rather thick, and evenly distributed around the room, chatting. When the big star arrives, the people nearest the door gather around her. As she moves through the party, she attracts the people closest to her, and those she moves away from return to their other conversations.

"By gathering a fawning cluster of people around her, she's gained momentum, an indication of mass. She's harder to slow down than she would be without the crowd. Once she's stopped, it's harder to get her going again."

INSIDE THE LARGE HADRON COLLIDER

True or not, you have to be amazed by everything about the LHC, the world's largest and most powerful particle accelerator.

The collider is a 17-mile looped tunnel designed to create "mini-Big Bangs" by smashing together particles. Inside the tunnel, essentially a massive donut that sits on the border between France and Switzerland, two beams of light are shot in either direction and accelerated with magnets to nearly the speed of light.

In order for the superconducting magnets to work at maximum efficiency, they are chilled to 519 degrees Farenheit -- colder than outer space. This means the LHC is also the world's largest refrigerator, the CERN website points out.

To record the incredibly fast and incredibly tiny collisions of hundreds of thousands of particles, there are several giant detectors -- essentially super high-speed cameras recording millions of data points per second. But because the Large Hadron Collider will produce roughly 15 petabytes (15 million gigabytes) of data annually, ordinary connections wouldn't be capable of transmitting all of that data fast enough.

To store all of the information coming out of the machine, the detectors are tied into a next-generation computer network called The Grid, a superfast network of fiber optic cables just to carry all that information.

Hal-9000
04-25-2011, 11:27 PM
not impressed...a whole lotta cash on subatomic speculation...


wanna really impress people? Fire a Higgs Boson particle through someone and prove that it happened :thumbsup:

Softdreamer
04-25-2011, 11:50 PM
Dont believe a word of it.

Im more a believer that when a group of particles are arranged in certain amounts, they create a field of energy that distorts space enough so as to appear to have mass.

Mass doesnt exist, just warping of space. On a large scale enough of these manipulations can cause space to fold enough that an effect called gravity can be observed.

99% of Quantum Theory is still just unproved theory. I dont believe a word of it.

Muddy
04-26-2011, 12:48 AM
not impressed...a whole lotta cash on subatomic speculation...


wanna really impress people? Fire a Higgs Boson particle through someone and prove that it happened :thumbsup:


Yeah, I think its a 15 billion dolla bag of hooey myself...

FBD
04-26-2011, 02:50 AM
:lol: you guys already think I'm crazy

Teh One Who Knocks
04-27-2011, 11:13 AM
CERN physics lab downplays claim of key discovery
By FRANK JORDANS, Associated Press


GENEVA – The world's biggest particle physics lab on Tuesday played down claims of a major discovery, after a leaked memo hinting that the elusive Higgs boson — or 'God particle' — may have been found ricocheted around science websites.

A spokesman for CERN, the European Organization for Nuclear Research, said the memo wasn't intended for publication and the claims likely wouldn't withstand closer scrutiny. If proven to exist, the Higgs particle could explain why matter has mass, an enormous scientific breakthrough.

"The note is certainly genuine," spokesman James Gillies told The Associated Press on Tuesday. But he said such memos are merely the very first step in a rigorous peer-review process that tends to result in spectacular claims being knocked down by other scientists.

"I think the excitement is due mainly to the incredible sense of anticipation there is in particle physics at the moment," said Gillies.

Thousands of researchers around the world are poring over data generated at CERN's $10-billion Large Hadron Collider near Geneva, and many expect it to produce significant discoveries about the makeup of matter and other mysteries of the universe in the years to come.

"The Higgs really is the Holy Grail of particle physics and that's why this is so important," said Phillip F. Schewe, a spokesman for the American Institute of Physics.

Previously, much of the initial debate would have taken place behind closed doors. But the buzz surrounding the Large Hadron Collider and the development of social media networks means even early-stage science is leaking out and quickly spreading worldwide.

"It's unusual for this sort of specific, detailed material to be made public," said Peter Woit, a physicist at Columbia University on whose blog the memo first appeared last week.

Woit said he chose not to suppress the posting, as it had already generated dozens of comments by the time he saw it — many of them skeptical. "This was accurate information of interest to my blog readers," he said.

The note was posted anonymously, but carried the names of four researchers working at CERN's Atlas experiment. Atlas is one of four giant detectors built to record high-energy proton collisions inside the collider's 17-mile (27-kilometer) tunnel beneath the Swiss-French border. The memo claims that abnormal measurements seen at a particular energy level are "the first definitive observation of physics beyond the standard model."

The authors of the note either declined or didn't respond to AP requests for comment. But Jon Butterworth, a physicist at University College London who also works with Atlas, said it was unfortunate the memo had been published.

"It's quite an overstated communication," he said, adding that about 30 such notes are circulated among Atlas scientists each week. Few make it into peer-reviewed journals.

Schewe compared the leaking of the memo to WikiLeaks' publication of U.S. foreign policy documents. "It's embarrassing, but probably in the long run not so bad," he said.

Deepsepia
04-27-2011, 11:42 AM
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. There's nothing to be gained by making a big claim on preliminary data . . . its an easy way to embarrass yourself.

The cool thing is that they're at energies we haven't seen before, which means they'll find something new. Whether it will be what they're expecting to find or something else, something unexpected . . . well that's still open.

Me, I vote for, (and hope for) something unexpected . . . that would be cooler in a lot of ways.

Acid Trip
04-27-2011, 01:01 PM
Just like an NBA athlete looks for his next contract a scientist is always looking for their next grant. As the article says she's made a similar claim as her old study was being shutdown which is awful suspicious.

FBD
04-27-2011, 01:57 PM
Acidtrip, the "old study" really had been producing "some promising results," but for political reasons the LEP was shuttered back in 2000 and had absolutely zero to do with the veracity (or lackthereof) of Ms Wu's studies. She does hit the gas pedal on trumping up her claims, though.

Actually her data trended pretty well with what we're seeing here at the LHC - but the LEP never reached this 115GeV, was looking like it was coming close before the politicians did away with it.

115 appears to be a pretty good number, Cassel (http://arxiv.org/abs/1001.3884)et al posited the least restrictive fine-tuning for the higgs at this value - although the diphoton branching ratio (i.e. that which made them go 'hmmm!!!') is peculiarly high and current theories dont peg the Higgs decaying quite like that.

Possible that this winds up being more evidence for supersymmetry before being something really concrete for the higgs...

FBD
05-03-2011, 02:36 PM
It appears that the excess diphoton events were a statistical blip, a preponderance of which wasnt borne out by the rest of the data.


A new rumor propagating via twitter, social networks and other attributes of modern civilization says that the old rumor was just a rumor. The ATLAS collaboration was working hard this last week to investigate the possible signal of Higgs decaying to photons. Observations of such a signal was claimed in an internal memo written by 4 of its members. However, after analyzing about 100 pb-1 of currently available data ATLAS concluded that the suspicious excess in the γγ invariant mass distribution is going away. C'est la vie, as the local folks would say. A parallel rumor says that CMS sees nothing unusual in the γγ channel. That would pretty much end the career of the first LHC rumor. Maybe it's for the better. Otherwise the Higgs boson would have to be renamed to the Wu boson which could lead to some confusion.

"CMS has looked into the same channel and it sees no excess of diphoton events. So sorry, Ms Wu." -Lubos