Genderless preschool bans 'him' and 'her'

[Teh One Who Knocks]

From: news.com.au


http://i.imgur.com/37StB.jpg
Teachers use gender neutral "emotion dolls" are to prevent
children from falling into gender stereotypes


Swedish preschool bans gendered terms
Staff avoid words such as "him" or "her"
33 students are referred to as "friends"


At the Egalia preschool, staff avoid using words like "him" or "her" and address the 33 kids as "friends" rather than girls and boys.

From the colour and placement of toys to the choice of books, every detail has been carefully planned to make sure the children don't fall into gender stereotypes.

"Society expects girls to be girlie, nice and pretty and boys to be manly, rough and outgoing," says Jenny Johnsson, a 31-year-old teacher.

"Egalia gives them a fantastic opportunity to be whoever they want to be."

The taxpayer-funded preschool which opened last year in the liberal Sodermalm district of Stockholm for kids aged one to six is among the most radical examples of Sweden's efforts to engineer equality between the sexes from childhood onward.

Breaking down gender roles is a core mission in the national curriculum for preschools, underpinned by the theory that even in highly egalitarian-minded Sweden, society gives boys an unfair edge.

To even things out, many preschools have hired "gender pedagogues" to help staff identify language and behaviour that risk reinforcing stereotypes.

Some parents worry things have gone too far. An obsession with obliterating gender roles, they say, could make the children confused and ill-prepared to face the world outside kindergarten.

"Different gender roles aren't problematic as long as they are equally valued," says Tanja Bergkvist, a 37-year-old blogger and a leading voice against what she calls "gender madness" in Sweden.

Those bent on shattering gender roles "say there's a hierarchy where everything that boys do is given higher value, but I wonder who decides that it has higher value," she says. "Why is there higher value in playing with cars?"

At Egalia - the title connotes "equality" - boys and girls play together with a toy kitchen, waving plastic utensils and pretending to cook. One boy hides inside the toy stove, his head popping out through a hole.

Lego bricks and other building blocks are intentionally placed next to the kitchen to make sure the children draw no mental barriers between cooking and construction.

Director Lotta Rajalin notes that Egalia places a special emphasis on fostering an environment tolerant of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered people. From a bookcase, she pulls out a story about two male giraffes who are sad to be childless - until they come across an abandoned crocodile egg.

Nearly all the children's books deal with homosexual couples, single parents or adopted children. There are no Snow White, Cinderella or other classic fairy tales seen as cementing stereotypes.

Rajalin, 52, says the staff also try to help the children discover new ideas when they play.

"A concrete example could be when they're playing 'house' and the role of the mom already is taken and they start to squabble," she says. "Then we suggest two moms or three moms and so on."

Egalia's methods are controversial; some say they amount to mind control. Rajalin says the staff have received threats from racists apparently upset about the preschool's use of black dolls.

But she says that there's a long waiting list for admission to Egalia, and that only one couple has pulled a child out of the school.

Jukka Korpi, 44, says he and his wife chose Egalia "to give our children all the possibilities based on who they are and not on their gender."

Sweden has promoted women's rights for decades, and more recently was a pioneer among European countries in allowing gay and lesbian couples to legalise their partnerships and adopt children.

Gender studies permeate academic life in Sweden. Bergkvist noted on her blog that the state-funded Swedish Science Council had granted $US80,000 ($A76,175) for a postdoctoral fellowship aimed at analysing "the trumpet as a symbol of gender."

Jay Belsky, a child psychologist at the University of California, Davis, said he's not aware of any other school like Egalia, and he questioned whether it was the right way to go.

"The kind of things that boys like to do - run around and turn sticks into swords - will soon be disapproved of," he said. "So gender neutrality at its worst is emasculating maleness."

Egalia is unusual even for Sweden. Staff try to shed masculine and feminine references from their speech, including the pronouns him or her - "han" or "hon" in Swedish. Instead, they've have adopted the genderless "hen," a word that doesn't exist in Swedish but is used in some feminist and gay circles.

"We use the word "hen" for example when a doctor, police, electrician or plumber or such is coming to the kindergarten," Rajalin says. "We don't know if it's a he or a she so we just say 'Hen is coming around 2pm' Then the children can imagine both a man or a woman. This widens their view."

Egalia doesn't deny the biological differences between boys and girls - the dolls the children play with are anatomically correct.

What matters is that children understand that their biological differences "don't mean boys and girls have different interests and abilities," Rajalin says. "This is about democracy. About human equality."

[Dragoness_Cutie]

I think that this is an interesting experiment. I would love to see the outcome of these kids when they reach adulthood.

[Godfather]

Sure. It's interesting.

But I sure as fuck won't be using my (future) children for a science experiment.

[Muddy]

Sure. It's interested.

But I sure as fuck won't be using my (future) children for a science experiment.

Winna winna, chicken dinna!

[PorkChopSandwiches]

I make my son tuck and tape every morning so he feels like nothing

[Muddy]

:lol:

[Deepsepia]

I think that this is an interesting experiment. I would love to see the outcome of these kids when they reach adulthood.

My mom had a big thing when my brother and I were kids: "no war toys".

My brother and I promptly made guns out of lego.

This stuff is wired into humans-- hell, its wired into primates. Go tell Mr Mountain Gorilla that he's not a "he".

http://picload.org/image/llladl/mountaingorilla.jpg

[PorkChopSandwiches]

My mom had a big thing when my brother and I were kids: "no war toys".

My brother and I promptly made guns out of lego.

This stuff is wired into humans-- hell, its wired into primates. Go tell Mr Mountain Gorilla that he's not a "he".

http://picload.org/image/llladl/mountaingorilla.jpg

I had some friends when I was around 10/11 whos parents had the same rule, and we did the exact same thing. You dont need a replica gun, we just used a bent stick :lol:

[Acid Trip]

I'm curious, are they going to keep the students from watching TV or reading books where gender roles are ever present? I think it's a poorly conceived experiment because there are far too many environmental variables.

[Godfather]

Holy shit I got in the worst argument with a friend of my girlfriends. She was saying I was a jerk for telling her I wouldn't let my son go to school with a barbie-doll if he wanted to. It was hard to be diplomatic to say the least

Can't remember what we all got to arguing but she's a sociology/psyc student and I can hardly stand another minute of this hippy dribble

[Acid Trip]

"Director Lotta Rajalin notes that Egalia places a special emphasis on fostering an environment tolerant of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgendered people. From a bookcase, she pulls out a story about two male giraffes who are sad to be childless - until they come across an abandoned crocodile egg.

Nearly all the children's books deal with homosexual couples, single parents or adopted children. There are no Snow White, Cinderella or other classic fairy tales seen as cementing stereotypes."

Fucking ridiculous. I can't believe I just read that.

[Godfather]

:lol: Pretty hilarious, offensive too really.

I'm actually indifferent to gay couple adopting and all that. But why does the education system have to be so polarized and lose its sanity? Why does the school system have to be (excuse this) as gay as the gayest person in town?

Get a grip...

[Deepsepia]

Nearly all the children's books deal with homosexual couples, single parents or adopted children. There are no Snow White, Cinderella or other classic fairy tales seen as cementing stereotypes..

Last I checked, millions of little girls want to be "princesses" . . . good luck with that one, Sweden

[Acid Trip]

Last I checked, millions of little girls want to be "princesses" . . . good luck with that one, Sweden

Not to mention that Sweden is still a monarchy...

[Jezter]

We have not been saying for years that Swedes are all homos for nothing. One more reason to hate them. Finland </3 Sweden.

[Muddy]

Isn't Anthem Swedish? :dance:

[AntZ]

Winna winna, chicken dinna!

I don't think so...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKMmvVOrsL8

[Jezter]

Isn't Anthem Swedish? :dance:

Poor guy... :(

[AntZ]

Isn't Anthem Swedish? :dance:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5-vsTxKUkM


I ain't no Scandinavian fruit cake! :beatdown:

[Jezter]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5-vsTxKUkM


I ain't no Scandinavian fruit cake! :beatdown:

Being Scandi isn't bad...being Swedish is! :lol:

[AntZ]

Being Scandi isn't bad...being Swedish is! :lol:

I'm in central Europe! Far away from the blood brownies and homos! :hand:

[Jezter]

I'm in central Europe! Far away from the blood brownies and homos! :hand:

The more distance between you and Sweden, the better. :tup:

[Hal-9000]

I think that this is an interesting experiment. I would love to see the outcome of these kids when they reach adulthood.


http://i.imgur.com/W1K6u.jpg

[DemonGeminiX]

The more distance between you and Sweden, the better. :tup:

:-k

But you're right next to them, so by default you're...









:twisted:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

http://i.imgur.com/W1K6u.jpg

Exactly

[Jezter]

:-k

But you're right next to them, so by default you're...









:twisted:

Why do you think we hate them so much? Duh... :rolleyes:

[DemonGeminiX]

:nono:

You're just jealous of their bikini team.

[Jezter]

:nono:

You're just jealous of their bikini team.

Jealous of a bunch of Hals in itsy bitsy bikini? Yea...right. :rolleyes:

[Deepsepia]

We have not been saying for years that Swedes are all homos for nothing. One more reason to hate them. Finland </3 Sweden.

Is that what you guys say?

No one knows, except maybe the Estonians . . .

[DemonGeminiX]

Jealous of a bunch of Hals in itsy bitsy bikini? Yea...right. :rolleyes:

:lol:

Oh, admit it. You can't look as half as good in a bikini as Hal does.

[Jezter]

Is that what you guys say?

No one knows, except maybe the Estonians . . .
And Norwegians. They are cool guys.

[Jezter]

:lol:

Oh, admit it. You can't look as half as good in a bikini as Hal does.

No, cuz I aint got half the tits and ass. :lol:

[Muddy]

No, cuz I aint got half the tits and ass. :lol:

That's debatable... :razz:

[Jezter]

That's debatable... :razz:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_fM060uc3S6o/SwbpPrfk2WI/AAAAAAAAAHE/ErrUz0scyQY/s1600/BigBoy4.JPG

[Muddy]

YeeeeHawww!!!! :dance: :lol:

[PorkChopSandwiches]

hahahahaha

[Hal-9000]

:lol:

Oh, admit it. You can't look as half as good in a bikini as Hal does.

I do rock a bikini..that is a fact




thx :thumbsup:

[Acid Trip]

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRraZIpgZqcJbMggMU7zEMpmQ1TKwBU5 iy9Ta3dfT4rNynx35j-

They should all wear shirts with that on the front.

[Hal-9000]

No, cuz I aint got half the tits and ass. :lol:

:x :x :x

Look here Bjork, you freaky sexy singer.Why don't you stick to writing odd music and leave the sexy to me

I'll have you know that I've been working out strenuously since being on holidays and my bod is already taking shape...

[Hal-9000]

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRraZIpgZqcJbMggMU7zEMpmQ1TKwBU5 iy9Ta3dfT4rNynx35j-

They should all wear shirts with that on the front.

So two young kids in that country are running to the bathrooms....what kinda signs are on the doors and does little Gretchen get to share a urinal with little Hans?

[PorkChopSandwiches]

So two young kids in that country are running to the bathrooms....what kinda signs are on the doors and does little Gretchen get to share a urinal with little Hans?

No, they all shit their pants together

[Hal-9000]

oh great...now in the kid's bathrooms there'll be more weeny pulling than at a Paul Reubens film festival ....:rolleyes:

[Acid Trip]

No, they all shit their pants together

Hahahahahahahahaha

[Hal-9000]

I peed on a girl's hand/arm once




:lol:

[Acid Trip]

I peed on a girl's hand/arm once




:lol:

And how much did that cost you? :mrgreen:

[Muddy]

I peed on a girl's hand/arm once




:lol:

I peed all over another child in pre-school while they slept on their cot.

[Hal-9000]

And how much did that cost you? :mrgreen:

I was seeing her at the time and she said she wanted to see what 'it feeled like' when a guy took a whiz.

So I let her hold, then quickly stepped back a bit and pissed all over her :lol:
I said - That's pretty much what it feels like :lol:

[PorkChopSandwiches]

I dont know if I could get a piss going with my dick in someone elses hand

[Hal-9000]

I peed all over another child in pre-school while they slept on their cot.

Makin friends everywhere since 1979 :lol:

[Hal-9000]

I dont know if I could get a piss going with my dick in someone elses hand

it almost started working the other way...I got a lil aroused :oops:

[Hal-9000]

nothin like peeing with a good arc :thumbsup: I always say

[Muddy]

Makin friends everywhere since 1979 :lol:

That was probably more like 74-75..

[Muddy]

I soaked that kid.... I drained my entire bladder on him.... He never even woke up....

[Hal-9000]

took a stab...

I've peed on the back of my friend's leg when we were walking home after a night of drinking :thumbsup:

true buds

[Teh One Who Knocks]

No, they all shit their pants together

:bwaha:

That was freaking hilarious :lol:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I think the best way to solve this issue would just be to castrate all the boys at birth and then if they decide they want to be a boy when they grow up, places like this can issue strap-ons to them. :)

:thumbsup:

[Hal-9000]

I like the PCS/and his son solution


scotch tape the little bastards until they all end up playing with Barbies fss :lol:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

And people wonder what's wrong with the world

[Hal-9000]

I believe in equality and feel that yes, young kids shouldn't be brought up with certain gender boundaries


but when you start calling them..."them", rather than he or she, you start blurring the line too much.
There are differences ffs

[Teh One Who Knocks]

No, I agree that there shouldn't be any gender boundaries, but if a little girl wants to read Cinderella or play with Barbie dolls, the she should be able to FFS

[Hal-9000]

I played man/pedi and make up with girls when I was young...no adverse effects here..

[Dragoness_Cutie]

No, I agree that there shouldn't be any gender boundaries, but if a little girl wants to read Cinderella or play with Barbie dolls, the she should be able to FFS
And so should a little boy. Conversely, there should be nothing wrong with either a boy or a girl deciding they want to play war and shoot pretend guns at one another. But think about how much we shame boys from doing girl-like things. I don't think there's anything wrong with a kid playing with both "girl" toys and "boy" toys, and I certainly don't think it's going to make them turn out to be gay.

Personally, I believe that sexuality is far more a product of nature than it is of upbringing. If you're going to be homo, hetero, or bisexual, it's already there. A little boy playing dolls with his big sister isn't going to "turn" him gay. And yet we seem to think it will. We ALSO think there is something wrong with that outcome in the first place. There is nothing wrong with being non-heterosexual, and yet we shudder at the thought of our children growing up to be anything but that.

This is why I find this preschool interesting. I think that gender roles are forced on us young, and that they shouldn't be.

[Hal-9000]

blue is for boys, pink is for girls :hand:


I used to room with people who would say - that's a blue job, meaning male and that's a pink job, meaning a girl's chore...I can't find a big enough eye rolling smiley here :lol:

[AntZ]

I played man/pedi and make up with girls when I was young...no adverse effects here..

So you've been told... :facepalm:

[Teh One Who Knocks]

And so should a little boy. Conversely, there should be nothing wrong with either a boy or a girl deciding they want to play war and shoot pretend guns at one another. But think about how much we shame boys from doing girl-like things. I don't think there's anything wrong with a kid playing with both "girl" toys and "boy" toys, and I certainly don't think it's going to make them turn out to be gay.

Personally, I believe that sexuality is far more a product of nature than it is of upbringing. If you're going to be homo, hetero, or bisexual, it's already there. A little boy playing dolls with his big sister isn't going to "turn" him gay. And yet we seem to think it will. We ALSO think there is something wrong with that outcome in the first place. There is nothing wrong with being non-heterosexual, and yet we shudder at the thought of our children growing up to be anything but that.

This is why I find this preschool interesting. I think that gender roles are forced on us young, and that they shouldn't be.

So, it's okay to have girl stuff for the boys to play with, but to completely ban real dolls and books like Cinderella for girls? Your logic works both ways...just because a girl likes to play with dolls and read Cinderella when she's young doesn't mean she's gonna grow up to become a housewife.

[Dragoness_Cutie]

They aren't keeping anyone from playing with dolls. They even mentioned that they have them in the article. The only thing they are censoring, from the sounds of it, are fairy tales that put men and women in specific gender roles, like Cinderella. Now do I agree that they are censoring things like this? No, but the fact that this is the one thing that they are doing that I don't entirely agree with makes me not get upset about it. And I agree with you that those things don't mean that a little girl will grow up to be a housewife, but we don't really know, because the society that we live in gives us very strict parameters as a child for what is for girls and what is for boys. Until we see how children NOT raised that way behave once they're older, how can we know?

[Jezter]

But how much does it really have an effect when outside this preschool the gender roles and such are very much present. What does it help if for a few hours a day they are called with gender-neutral names and that crap? The nature will take its way no matter what unless you forcefully make it go away. And I don't even dare to think what will happen to those confused little things then. Let children be children and be boys and girl. I don't think it is such terrible crime to call girl a girl and a boy a boy. Since that is what they are in the end.

[Muddy]

because the society that we live in gives us very strict parameters as a child for what is for girls and what is for boys.

I don't think it's as strict as you are making it out to be. Case in point. I have a 6 year old daughter that trains in an MMA school twice a week.

[Dragoness_Cutie]

But how much does it really have an effect when outside this preschool the gender roles and such are very much present. What does it help if for a few hours a day they are called with gender-neutral names and that crap? The nature will take its way no matter what unless you forcefully make it go away. And I don't even dare to think what will happen to those confused little things then. Let children be children and be boys and girl. I don't think it is such terrible crime to call girl a girl and a boy a boy. Since that is what they are in the end.
That's the part that I am concerned with, to be honest. If they were in this environment for majority of the day, and their parents were enforcing it at home, then I think that it would be more likely to yield a result that would have the children choosing what they want to do regardless of being a boy or a girl. I bet there would be less alpha male guys out of this group, and less passive-aggressive girls, too.

To be honest, the him/her thing is a little odd to me, but by getting rid of that division, it helps foster the understanding that the kids are all equal, and being treated the same, so I would guess that is why they are doing that.

This is as much something that matters at home as anywhere else, though. Children learn gender roles early in life, usually somewhere between 2-3 years old and 5-6 years old is the time period where these things are established in their minds. So if the child is being taught in this preschool, but goes home to parents who are very stereotypical in the things that they do, then it's not going to matter, because they are going to learn it at home. The reverse is also true of lessons of gender neutrality at home being undone by stereotypes at school.

While I think that this experiment is a good one, and might happen to broaden the horizons of a generation of kids that go there, I'm not sure that it's actually going to change their behavior so much as their outlook, but that in and of itself could be a very good thing, so... *shrugs*

Sorry, I know I'm rambling a bit. I wanted to respond before work, and I haven't had my coffee yet. :lol:

[Jezter]

I think there are much better ways to teach people about toleration than make everything tasteless, colorless and bland... If our future is to be eunuchs that reproduce in labs and we just are one gray mass... I don't want to see that future.

People are what they are; gay, lesbian, transgender...what ever they want to be. Letting them be what they want to be is something everyone should learn in some different ways than starting to breed genderless people and let them "choose" what they want to be. I mean... they don't just select and decide that "hey, I want to be a lesbian!". It is in them to begin with so... I don't know. To me this is just all silly.

[Dragoness_Cutie]

I don't think this is making things bland in any way, to be honest. If anything, I think more diversity will come from this. There'll be more outspoken girls and more quiet guys, but there will still be all the other flavors in between.

[Jezter]

Lets hope so! :tup:

[Muddy]

I think it's all a bunch of politically correct BS where non hetero's are trying to punish heteros for being normal.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

I think it's all a bunch of politically correct BS where non hetero's are trying to punish heteros for being normal.

:+1: