NHL and other ice hockey discussion

[samarchepas]

Thus my facepalm Fucking idiots might as just be sitting around talking about The Bachelor, they're so far off the important things...

I start to remember why Bettman is the most hated sports league commissioner, his strategy, the way I see it: wait till the players are at their breaking point...the thing is, some fans are already at this point and won't be back to support their team.Third lock-out that he got into, he just thinks that the fans will be back no matter what. BTW no negotiations scheduled! (With 0 progress in the last session)

[Richard Cranium]

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=407490

The NHL put a new offer on the bargaining table for the NHL Players' Association on Tuesday morning, which includes a 50/50 split of hockey-related revenue across the board and contingent on an 82-game season beginning Nov. 2.

"We hope we've given our best shot," NHL commissioner Gary Bettman told reporters on Tuesday afternoon.

Bettman added that the offer calls for no salary rollback and the revised schedule - if implemented - would see one week of training camp and every team playing an extra regular season game every five weeks.

NHLPA executive director Donald Fehr said the offer - which is at least six years in length - is an "excellent start" and he would go over it with his membership in a 5pm et conference call.

Negotiations resumed Tuesday in Toronto in the NHL's labour dispute with the NHL Players Association - the first in five days following two days of meetings in New York last week. Key negotiators Bettman, Bill Daly and Donald and Steve Fehr were in attendance as both sides looked to start bridging the gap on core economic issues.

Both sides have communicated regularly since the lockout began on Sept. 15, but with little to no progress so far as the meetings have focused on non-core economic discussions.

Neither side had formally tabled an offer since Sept. 12.

[DemonGeminiX]

[Godfather]

New CBA offer looks great. 50/50, 5 year contracts, only 1 year longer to get to free agency, entry level contracts remain the same. Sounds good, let's fuggin' play.

Apparently it would still be an 82 game season, not condensed like the NBA did, just lasting into late June

[samarchepas]

New CBA offer looks great. 50/50, 5 year contracts, only 1 year longer to get to free agency, entry level contracts remain the same. Sounds good, let's fuggin' play.

Apparently it would still be an 82 game season, not condensed like the NBA did, just lasting into late June

Good for negociation yes, but it won't be the last offer done here (From what I see, the 50/50 ain't really a 50/50)
IF the league's growth is the same (or better) yes it is but if it not the case, it's far less.

[Godfather]

I think the bigger sticking point could be the 5 year contract, or more specifically roll backs but hopefully not. 5 years is still a long time in the world of sport.

If the NHLPA doesn't take this deal or something very close to it, they'll look greedy as fuck to the people who are still on their side/on the fence.

[samarchepas]

I think the bigger sticking point could be the 5 year contract, or more specifically roll backs but hopefully not. 5 years is still a long time in the world of sport.

If the NHLPA doesn't take this deal or something very close to it, they'll look greedy as fuck to the people who are still on their side/on the fence.

I'm telling you...this WON'T go as it is right now (Something similar, but not as it is right now)
It's a good thing to get negociations going though. I agree that shorter contracts= forces the player to work more for the next contract (No more "I don't care, I have a 15 years contract!") I want a CBA that the 2 sides like...or the same damn thing will start again in 6 years.

[Godfather]

Agreed... hopefully 50/50 is agreeable long term. It's seldom mentioned, but the NFL has one of the best revenue sharing systems going and it has taken the league a long way (and been a big factor in avoiding lockouts from what I've learned the last week or two).

[samarchepas]

Yup, the revenue sharing is a lot better in the NFL than the NHL...they will either have to change the way it is done or just get rid of the teams that ain't getting fans. (Phoenix for example, at least one team in Florida...etc) Again with the 50/50, the tricky part will be having both sides having the same definition of 50/50 (They had to discuss about ice condition last week, remember? )

[Godfather]

I hope that aside side from the obvious signing of a new CBA, the league shrinks soon and a few teams are moved to Canada or northern US like Washington. It would make the CBA much less difficult for 'poor' and 'rich' owners to agree upon too.

[samarchepas]

I hope that aside side from the obvious signing of a new CBA, the league shrinks soon and a few teams are moved to Canada or northern US like Washington. It would make the CBA much less difficult for 'poor' and 'rich' owners to agree upon too.

Sadly, Bettman doesn't think that way He probably will look at an expansion instead (more money for the league in the short term)
They keep saying that the league is doing great but look at all the teams losing money in there...Canada and the northern US are making Bettman look good even with his big mistakes.

[Teh One Who Knocks]

If the NHLPA doesn't take this deal or something very close to it, they'll look greedy as fuck to the people who are still on their side/on the fence.

NEW YORK (AP) -- NHL labor negotiations will resume Thursday after the players' union reviewed management's proposal and saw it as only a small step forward to ending the monthlong lockout.

[Godfather]

That blows.

A guy on the radio was saying the players are still pissed off, offended and unified by the NHL's first offer of 43% and will sit out for 3 months if it means getting 54%.

Idiots.

[samarchepas]

The way I see it...Two spoiled kids fighting for a toy...and there is nothing we can do about it!
(The NHLPA is expected to make an offer today)

[Godfather]

This local writer thinks the 5-year thing is meant by NHL to punish Owners with long term contracts on their teams (I guess they're not unified, big surprise). Interesting read. Sorry for the weird format.

Jason Botchford
The Province

There wasn’t panic or rage over at Rogers Arena with the CBA clause
that threatens to work like a punch to the Canucks salary cap gut.

There shouldn’t be. The so-called Roberto Luongo rule — or Ilya
Kovalchuk rule, take your pick — is just a proposal at this point. And
it’s one which, even if ratified, won’t start having an impact until
this next CBA expires.
But what a proposal. It works like a time machine in an attempt to
rewrite history. Remember the resolution the NHL reached over
long-term deals in the Kovalchuk case?
Settled, right? Old news, correct? Well, the league would like to
reopen the case.
The so-called back-diving deals, like the contracts signed by Luongo,
Kovalchuk, Marian Hossa, several in Philadelphia and two in Minnesota,
would get a significant, long-lasting wrinkle if Gary Bettman has his
way.
Essentially, in deals longer than five years, the average cap hit will
continue to count after the player retires for the length of the
contract. By the way, Luongo is 33, and has 10 years left on his deal.
The proposal even has this kicker: If the player is traded, his cap
hit when he retires will revert back to the original team that signed
him to the back-diving contract. (Enjoy the new acronym BDC).
So, the Canucks deal Luongo, he hangs them up to go play professional
poker, and it’s Vancouver which is on the hook for his $5.3 million
cap hit until 2022.
Some nice vindictive CBAing right there.
Is it excessively punitive against teams which signed deals
permissible under the old CBA? Of course. It punishes general managers
who played by the rules. For what?
It doesn’t do anything to limit back-diving deals moving forward
because under the latest proposal no contracts are permitted to be
longer than five years.
So, why go back? Better yet, who would come up with an idea like this?
For sure Bettman, who was furious when teams exploited the loophole.
But he wasn’t alone. This is his chance for payback.
Nearly half the league (14 teams) have players signed to deals that
are eight years or longer. Why would any of these teams risk the dead
cap space early retirements are going to create?
Take a look at Philadelphia, where it would rain down salary cap
hellsicles if Jeff Carter, Mike Richards and Ilya Bryzgazlov all
retired next season..
There was, however, one general manager who publicly ripped the
Kovalchuk deal, testified for the league at the arbitration hearing
and boasts about never signing a player to a contract longer than five
years.
That would be Brian Burke who, when interviewed by the Globe and Mail
on this topic a couple of years ago said:
“I don’t mind being on an island. I’ve done it consistently throughout
my career where I believe there’s a principle involved.”
What this won’t do is change the Canucks plans to trade Luongo. The
proposal has no impact on the dynamics of a trade. The Canucks would
take the salary cap hit when Luongo retires, whether it’s in
Vancouver, Chicago, Toronto, Florida or Edmonton.
You could argue this gives a little more incentive to the Canucks
arch-rivals who have been pursuing Luongo. They’d get the goalie and
get to watch the Canucks get screwed when he retires. Not a bad cherry
to put on the deal.
But Luongo isn’t going to retire anytime soon. He has six more years
where he gets $6.7 million per season. In the seventh, his salary is
$3.4 million. He’s likely to play all of those years.
The current NHL proposal is six years long with an option for a
seventh. That essentially moves the real debate on this issue to the
next CBA, because most of the players who signed BDC’s won’t retire
until the next CBA expires.
By then, you can bet GM Mike Gillis will be gone.
Still, it’s difficult seeing the players accepting it this time
around. Any dollar of dead cap space is a dollar not being spent on
players.
In the Philadelphia scenario, let’s say Richards moves on to be a
professional surfer, Carter leaves the NHL to travel South America and
the flakey Bryzgalov stays in Russia to play in the KHL. That’s $16.6
million in dead cap space the Flyers can’t spend. In a word: Phuck.
With nearly half the league having players signed to deals at least
eight years, that’s not an insignificant amount of potential dead cap
space sitting out there.